[Dixielandjazz] Trad Jazz

[Marek Boym]

>>
>> Soul?  Free wheeling?  It's difficult to put one's finger on it.  The
>> band just sounds as if it were holding back rather than letting itself
>> go.
>
> I'm puzzled by this Marek.
> I'm listening to this band with Geo. Lewis playing 'Weary Blues'.

We were not discussing Gerorge Lewis.  With Lewis they might have
steamed.  The later bands did.  BTW, while still a young jazz fan, I
went to hear Colyer in London in 1964, and he did not live up to my
expectations, which were based on my jazz Bible (Rex Harris'  and
Brian Rust's "recorded Jazz: A Critical Guide").


 Despite
> doubling in tempo in the first chorus (it was too slow to start with) the
> band, driven by Colin, steams
>
>
>> A wonderful drummer, Colin Bowden, but he has developed since then.
>> Or perhaps the band was trying to sound "New Orleans" so hard as to be
>> afraid to take freedoms and make mistakes.  Something that often
>> happens to bands playing tribute to Ellington.
>
> We must be listening to different recordings. These are not perfect
> recordings by any means, but with a great spirit.
I miss that spirit on the records in question.  Later recordings were
much more spirited.


 The Barber band sounds
> like a dance band with a banjo in comparison.

Beauty lies in the ear of the listener?  The Barber rhythm section at
the time was a little stodgy, but the front line was much more
swinging than Colyer's.
>
.
>
> I got into a spat on the Radio 3 message board following Chris' Jazz Library
> programme last year where said something along the lines that this was his
> favourite rhythm section. I can't remember the quote. Someone said that they
> thought he got close to the New Orleans feel. I disagreed. It is not only
> Chris - most of what we knew as British Trad was appallingly far of the mark
> rhythmically. Listen to any recording with Baby Dodds, Zutty, or Black Happy
> Goldston and then listen to a Barber record. The difference will leap out at
> you.

Sure.  It took the British traditional rhythm sections a while to
catch up.  Surprising, too, considering the playing of British rhythm
sections during the swing era.

Colyer and Bilk on the other got much closer. It wasn't the same - but
> closer.

Bilk is nostalgia - I heard him in Poland in 1954 or 1955, when I was
in my early teens.  But he, too, made some really "British Trad"
records, too, with all that term conveys.  And some sublime records.

> There is a very good video of the Barber band on YouTube swinging - but
> Colin is on drums.

I have some records of Barber with Bowden on drums.  And I do agree
that he is an excellent drummer.  I did mention it in my previous.

Cheers
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHUoShDkgbg&feature=related
>
> Compare that to the Barber band in '62 as was:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_2eFnjwD0Q
>
>
>>> British trad spawned Euro Trad which was one more step removed from the
>>> source.
>
>> Is it wrong to be "removed from the source?"  I don't think so.
>> Actually, I am quite happy to hear musicians whose influences include
>> Barber, Colyer, etc.  Unless you want to copy, you must go your own
>> way.  And I do not mean going avant garde.
>>
>
>
> In my view, yes - if you are trying to create the feel of the music - but
> that is subjective. Every body copies to a certain extent - but surely it is
> better to copy a Bechet or an Armstrong than a Colyer or a Barber!
>
>
> --
> John Petters
> www.traditional-jazz.com
> Amateur Radio Station G3YPZ
>