[Dixielandjazz] What is Dixieland?

[Stephen G Barbone]

On Jan 13, 2011, at 9:19 AM, Marek Boym wrote: (polite snip)
>>
>> Barbone wrote - Another of my points is in  agreement with Richard  
>> Sudhalter who in
>> discussing Dixieland vs. Small Band Swing made the following  
>> observation in
>> "Lost Chords". (page 279)
>>
>> He opines that "by the mid 1930s, the word 'dixieland' was being  
>> applied
>> freely to certain circles of white musicians, first by the trade  
>> press and
>> then the public."
>>
>> "Often such compartmentalization ignored the sound of the music" he
>> continues and then compares 2 records of "I've Found a New Baby"
>>
>> 1) 1937 with a Teddy Wilson band, with Buck Clayton, Buster Bailey,  
>> Lester
>> Young in the front line.
>>
>> and
>>
>> 2) 1939 Summa Cum Laude with Max Kaminsky, Pee Wee Russell and Brad  
>> Gowans
>> in the front line.
>>
>> He goes on to say that the two records are similar in structure and  
>> feel,
>> have ensemble polylinearity and band riffing and have vigorous solos.
>
> Marek Answers - I have never thought so, but I'm prepared to listen  
> again and compare.
> But in the case of the Summa Cum Laude it was not only the colour,
> but also the musicians: None of those on the Wilson recording was ever
> identified with Dixieland, albeit (much) later Claytopn joined Condon,
> and Bailey played with the then fashionable traditional jazz bands.
> The group comprising the Summa Cuym Laude had been identified with
> Dixieland since the 1920's.

Mafrek: That is precisely Sudhalter's point. That for reasons  
unrelated to the style of music Black bands like Wilson's were  
playing, that music was not called Dixieland by the talking heads, nor  
were the black musicians associated with playing Dixieland by the  
WHITE audience. Yet he opines that they were indeed playing Dixieland.  
NOTE the below paragraph. To fully examine the issue, you might read  
page 279 in Sudhalter's "Lost Chords".

>>
>> Yet the white band's music was called Dixieland and the black  
>> band's music
>> was called small band swing.
>> by the trade press and the public. The rest of the discussion on  
>> that page
>> is worth noting if folks have the book. Especially the Bud Freeman  
>> comment
>> about how a "substantial musician" will say he just plays music and  
>> stays
>> away from categories imposed mostly by people who are not  
>> musicians. Kind of
>> like some Max Kaminsky comments that fans, record collectors, the  
>> media, the
>> critics etc., etc., should stop trying to categorize jazz and just  
>> let the
>> musicians play.
>