[Dixielandjazz] Dogfight

[Rickz]

Well I was impressed with his piano playing, and he talks good, but I 
think he just stole the term "dogfight"
to use for what we (jokingly) called "a musical intertube."   There's no 
fighting going on.  It's just contrapuntal.

There is frequently an out chorus on many jazz tunes, but it is 
orchestrated pretty carefully..
I just listened to a bunch of Firehouse Five tunes, and they don't 
dogfight.... they have a pretty well arranged
(or planned out) outchorus.

BTW, I don't give a damn what they do in Marches.   Trad Jazz is dance 
music, don't you know???

Rick On 12/27/2011 1:35 PM, Stephen G Barbone wrote:
>
>>  John McClernan <mcclernan1 at verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Dec 25, 2011, at 8:43 PM, Jim O'Briant wrote:
>>
>> In American marches, the term "Dogfight" has a different meaning. It 
>> refers
>> to a interlude in the TRIO section, often characterized by a "call and
>> response" -- 4 measures in the bass instruments, with an answer from 
>> treble
>> instruments, the same again (often in a different relative key), and 
>> then a
>> few measures leading into the reprise of the TRIO section....
>>
>>
>> And since a quantity of dixieland standards transmogrified from 
>> marches (and quadrilles, et alia), Jim's parallel is spot on.
>> My ?.02
>
> I'm with John & Jim on this one.
>
> In listening to the Frisco Jazz Band on youtube what I heard at the 
> end was the "Out Chorus", and not a dogfight. And a wonderful out 
> chorus it was.
>
> For a coherent discussion of "dogfight" and how it is structured (not 
> much improv usually) in Dixieland see:
>
> http://www.youtu.be/watch?v=EXrJ6E7SKhQ&feature=related
>
> Or consider this from "Jazz: America's Classical Music" By Grover 
> Sales which explains where the "dogfight" in ragtime came from during 
> the late 19th Century It follows that the dogfight carried over into 
> Dixieland shortly thereafter in the early 20th century. (page 51)
>
> "The most dominant flavor of ragtime, aside from its infectious 
> rhythm, was the black adaptation of German and Italian marching band 
> music . . . Certain conventions of marching band music carried over 
> into piano ragtime like the 'dogfight', a chromatic (key changing 
> interlude) interlude and teaser that prefaced the all-out grand climax 
> of favorites like Sousa's 'The Stars and Stripes Forever'. You can 
> hear a dogfight in the first rag ever published, 'Mississippi Rag' by 
> W.H. Krell . . . 'The Maple Leaf Rag' even bore the indication 'Tempo 
> di Marcia'. The 'front line' instruments of early dixieland jazz came 
> out of the marching band: the cornet playing the lead, the clarinet 
> playing trills in the treble (perhaps in imitation of the piccolo), 
> and the trombone playing a vamp bass line."
>
> Cheers,
> Steve Barbone
> www.myspace.com/barbonestreetjazzband
>
>
>
>
>
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