[Dixielandjazz] Grants for Arts>>Putting People To Work

Tue Mar 10 18:12:18 PDT 2009

<<It takes government money to support the arts in schools whether it  be 
music tuition of all sorts, appreciation of the visual arts, generation of  
interest and maybe love of great literature or are you suggesting that all such  
tuition should be paid for out of the pockets of pupils or their  parents.>>

What you don't get is the fact that tuition IS paid out of the pocket of  
parents. It's called taxes. And, in my case, I not only pay for MY kids to be  
educated, but also someone else's kids . . . I get taxed twice. It's called  
choosing my own school instead of letting the government dictate it, so hence, I  
get a double hit.

But that aside, I was NOT talking about the very BASIC NECCESSITY of music  
as part of a person's BASIC EDUCATION. Education has nothing whatsoever to do  
with my comments about arts receiving government grants.

<<In this country and most others around the world without government  
subsidy there would be no performances of opera or the great classical  works.>>

Then maybe they should not exist at all. If enough people feel this should  
exist, it will. Grants for art do NOT necessarily need to come from government  
(translate - coerced) funding. Any group of people can get together 
VOLUNTARILY  and use THEIR OWN money to fund such things, just as is the case and has 
been  the case here for many, many decades.

Classical music, and many other "arts" that are not popular enough to exist  
solely on the free market offerings of ticket sales have always been supported 
 by foundations, charitable giving, and corporate support. All VOLUNTARY.

I'm sorry, but I, like the previous poster, have spent my entire life,  
working to make a living with my music, based upon creating a product that  someone 
would find worthy of paying for . . . on FREE MARKET principles, in our  FREE 
ENTERPRISE system. Not one time in my life, have I ever taken, nor accepted  
a government handout. When time are tough, they're tough, and you do the best  
you can, and become as resourceful as possible. Without NECCESSITY, there is 
no  INVENTION.

If enough people deem something worthy of support, if the government will  
LEAVE THEM ALONE, and ME ALONE, they will come up with the ideas necessary to  
see it survive.

<<Are you suggesting that the audience for such an event would need  to be 
exceedingly well-heeled to even contemplate a visit to such a  performance?>>

In this country, they probably deserve to. Odds are, they paid for it in  the 
first place. According to data from the Internal Revenue Service, the top 1 
percent of income earners pay nearly 35  percent of the income tax burden; the 
top 10 percent pay 65 percent; and the top  25 percent pay nearly 83 percent.

All arts should be included in our support of education. Past academia,  
those who care about something in the arts, should get off their butts, quit  
looking to government to take it forcefully from you and me to give it to them,  
and find ways to make their business models work.

If not enough people find it worthy enough to support it VOLUNTARILY with  
their OWN money, then maybe it should not exist here at all.

After all, it will never totally go away. Your governments in Europe will  
find no problem in taking your money from you to make sure it survives.

Bill

In a message dated 3/10/2009 6:24:45 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
jazzjerry at btinternet.com writes:

Hi Bill,

I  really do find your attitude completely philistine. Like many others I 
find  some of the arts project supported by my taxes to be not to my taste and  
sometimes I feel the money is being misspent but without government help there  
would be no 'arts' only the type of crass trash one sees on TV in such as 
'The  X Factor' etc. etc.

It takes government money to support the arts in  schools whether it be music 
tuition of all sorts, appreciation of the visual  arts, generation of 
interest and maybe love of great literature or are you  suggesting that all such 
tuition should be paid for out of the pockets of  pupils or their parents.

In this country and most others around the  world without government subsidy 
there would be no performances of opera or  the great classical works. Whilst 
it might only cost $500 or less to put on a  third rate dixieland band the 
wages cost of a 100 piece symphony orchestra or  a full scale opera is a little 
higher without adding in all the other  overheads. Are you suggesting that the 
audience for such an event would need  to be exceedingly well-heeled to even 
contemplate a visit to such a  performance?

Similarly the great masterpieces of painting and sculpture  would not be 
visible except to the stinking rich and there would be none of  the great art 
galleries of the world such as the Prado in Madrid, Louvre in  Paris or the 
National Gallery in London.

Putting taxes into the arts  enriches all of the members of a society as well 
as providing employment to  artists and many others. A country run by a 
government which is not prepared  to support the culture and arts of, and for, the 
people would be a very sad  and sterile place indeed. 

Anyway I would rather see my taxes spent on  'The Arts' than being wasted on 
waging unjust and un-winnable wars.  

Jerry
Norwich,
U.K.
"Make Music Not War!"

--- On  Tue, 10/3/09, BillSargentDrums at aol.com <BillSargentDrums at aol.com>  
wrote:

> From: BillSargentDrums at aol.com  <BillSargentDrums at aol.com>
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Grants  for Arts>>Putting People To Work
> To: "Jerry Brown"  <jazzjerry at btinternet.com>
> Cc:  dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> Date: Tuesday, 10 March, 2009, 8:06  PM
> <<All of us should remind our local representatives  of
> this reality  and push 
> for restoring and adding more  Arts Grants to the government
> budgets.?  People 
> love the  results...it gives them things to do and does not
> directly hit   
> their own pockets.?>>
>  
> That's a fallacy.  It is directly out of their own
> pockets. Yes, there's a  
>  middleman, government, that charges a handling fee . . .
> but all too  often,  
> people forget: any time the government spends  (grants)
> money, it is YOUR money  
> and MY money and THEIR  money.
>  
> I'm getting doggone tired of people thinking  the
> governmental funds are  free 
> money.
>   
> I say let all the arts stand on public votes, called
> dollars,  and let them  
> survive or die without ANY governmental  intervention
> whatsoever.
>  
> Bill
>   
>  
> In a message dated 3/10/2009 12:48:22 P.M. Central  Daylight
> Time,  
> budtuba at aol.com writes:
> 
>   Subject:&  Grants for Arts>>Putting People To  Work
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> Just a comment and a  private beef.? I just  got a news
> letter from our local 
> Arts Council of   Rochester and they were talking about
> reversing Gov. 
>  Patterson's (NY) plans to  cut back on arts grants.?
> They talked  at length about how 
> these grants are  providing what patrons  want
> (performances, art shows, 
> educational programs,   etc), how many people are employed
> by the effects of grants, 
>  and the ancillary  businesses that benefit (restaurants,
> hotels,  etc.) they 
> seem to neglect that  the recipients of grants  thereby get
> paid for their efforts 
> and that THEY  spend  this money on the stuff of their
> lives, too.? If Obama, 
> or  Patterson, or  any government official wants to
> stimulate the  economy and 
> put people to work,  there probably is no better  and
> fasterway than to provide 
> an ARTS  GRANT.
>  
> 
> 
> All of us should remind our local representatives  of  this
> reality and push 
> for restoring and adding more  Arts Grants to the 
> government budgets.? People 
> love the  results...it gives them things to do and  does not
> directly hit  their 
> own pockets.? Many forms of arts will not survive   on
> instant popularity 
> alone.? Much as a modernist painting  takes time to 
> appreciate, OKOM needs new 
> exposure to young  ears to regain the popularity it  once
> had.? We often have young  
> people enthusiastically ask about the music we   play...as
> if we invented it.? 
> We tell them where to go and  find more.? They do  come
> back..many of 
> them..once they  realize that they like  it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Roy (Bud)   Taylor
> 
> Smugtown Stompers Jazz Band
> 
> Trad Jazz  since 1958...we  ain't just whistling  dixie!
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
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