[Dixielandjazz] 12/8 Time

[David Richoux]

Jane,

For "Simple Time Signatures"  the bottom number of a time signature  
just indicates which length of note is used for counting - in the  
case of 4/4 case it is an Quarter note, and there are 4 of them per  
measure. "Compound Time" like 12/8 would be 4 groups of three 8th  
Triplets (dotted eight notes) per measure (unless I am  
misinterpreting the system.) \xxx xxx xxx xxx\ so it would be a   
waltz, but with an overall 4/4 feel. I don't know of an actual  
composition in 12/8.

( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_signature sort of explains this. )


Diverting a bit further, I recently read an interview with Frank  
Zappa - before he took music theory classes and learned "the rules"  
he would write music that he thought "looked artistic" or  
"interesting" - not knowing if could be actually playable!
http://home.online.no/~corneliu/mother1.htm

Dave Richoux

On Jul 2, 2007, at 9:39 AM, Janie McCue Lynch wrote:

> Hope I'm not boring all by revisiting the "Time" topic....but the  
> 12/8 time
> is puzzling to me when referred to as a waltz beat.  I am still not  
> really
> clear how this is going to work as a waltz. Steve's (Eupher Dude)  
> pie chart
> example is most excellent.....but i still can't fit everything  
> together.
>
> I can break the 12 into "3"beats per measure on top by pulsing  
> 1,2,3,4 three
> times....but I can't get the 8 to work!  To maintain any semblance  
> of a
> waltz, I can work in 6 beats on the bottom...(two beats on top to  
> one on
> bottom)...but not 8.  Even with a weird syncopation....just doesn't  
> work for
> me.  Not even for a jazz-type of waltz.
>
> I was thinking back to more classical pieces such as Clair de Lune  
> which has
> a lot of irregular rhythms....and the beats are all intermingled
> appropriately...but it sure isn't a waltz!
>
> What am I missing?  (Contrary to the quote of "If you have to ask  
> you'll
> never know."...I often find that's really a GREAT way to find out!"
>
> Thanks!  :-)
>
> Jane Lynch
>
> Janie
> janie39 at socal.rr.com <mailto:janie39 at socal.rr.com>
>
> Eupher Dude wrote:
>
>
> 12/8 is basically a waltz.
>
> 12/8 is the same as 4/4 with a triple subdivision, instead of  
> duple.  123
> 223 323 423 instead of 12 22 32 42        6/8 is 2/4 with a triple
>
> A pie chart can help.  The whole bar is one pie.  Cut it into 3  
> pieces, it's
> a waltz.  4 pieces, a foxtrot (or whatever)  Then, subdivide it  
> into duples
> or triples.
>
> steve
>
>
>
>
>
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