[Dixielandjazz] urge to innovate

[Patrick Cooke]

Tito said:

>>>The exaggerate urge to innovate can lead into create or trying to
originate a new idiom, and forget all the cultural, historical, social,
humanistic conditions where Jazz originated.<<<

Whoever originated jazz (Louis? JRM?Bolden?someone previous to them, I'm
sure) WAS an innovator.  Is he/she to be the last one allowed?????

>>>This new idiom can even be good music, deserves a new name,  but
certainly will not deserve to be
called Jazz; otherwise the word Jazz will lose all its meaning and serve as
marketing pitch for all kinds of garbage.<<<

The word "Jazz" is a mighty big umbrella.  Is there no room under it for
anything new?  My guess is that there is a lot of jazz that you would rather
not see under your umbrella.

>>.On the other side, artists with the stature of Bechet, Armstrong,
Jelly-Roll, capable of creating a new musical context, are not easy to
find now-a-days. Do you know one?<<<

At least you admit they were innovators!  Therefore, innovation can't be all
that bad...Right??!!  You're right...there are not many around.  But there
are a lot of them that have passed through since Bechet, Louis, JRM, et al.
 There was Art Tatum, Irving Fazola, Johnny Hodges, Rick Lillard, Coleman
Hawkins, Dizzy, Bird, Joe Pass, and many whose styles have been, and still
are, "emulated". I still hear excellent clarinet players playing licks
originated by Fazola.  And show me a good alto sax player who doesn't use
those sexy glissandos played by Hodges.  If you don't know who Rick Lillard
is, get some of the recordings of the Air Force Men Of Note that were made
around the seventies. Dizzy certainly opened new doors, as did Charlie
Parker, and yes, it IS jazz.

 >>>My theory: if you want to express your poetry in Russian, first learn
Russian, it's grammatical rules and syntaxes, pronunciation, and then
put all your creativity to express your inspiration in this idiom. Jazz
is an Idiom;  we should learn it's syntaxes and pronunciation and then
express our creativity.<<<

    I could not imagine wanting to express poetry in Russian unless I was
already familiar with the language and fond of it enough to want to wax
poetic in it.  And if you haven't read any poetry lately, poets are
constantly breaking the rules of grammar, misspelling and mispronouncing
words, and inventing new syntax....It's called poetic license.  Let's
see...where did I put that musicians' license?
        Pat Cooke

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tito Martino" <tmartino@terra.com.br>
To: <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 4:16 PM
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] urge to innovate


--Sheik stated: <<<< The urge to innovate is strictly a personal matter.
In the music market where one is trying to make a living, bandleaders
innovators to be a pain in the buttox, because those with the urge to
innovate usually display obnoxious egotism, and worse, usually
can't/won't conform to the band's style sufficiently to play so as to
make the band sound good...>>>>     I completely agree.

The exaggerate urge to innovate can lead into create or trying to
originate a new idiom, and forget all the cultural, historical, social,
humanistic conditions where Jazz originated. This new idiom can even be
good music, deserves a new name,  but certainly will not deserve to be
called Jazz; otherwise the word Jazz will lose all its meaning and serve
as marketing pitch for all kinds of garbage.
Or this already occurs?

On the other side, artists with the stature of Bechet, Armstrong,
Jelly-Roll, capable of creating a new musical context, are not easy to
find now-a-days. Do you know one?

My theory: if you want to express your poetry in Russian, first learn
Russian, it's grammatical rules and syntaxes, pronunciation, and then
put all your creativity to express your inspiration in this idiom. Jazz
is an Idiom;  we should learn it's syntaxes and pronunciation and then
express our creativity.   If some one wants to innovate, please go to
John Cage department. I like it too, and very much, but don't call it
Jazz.


Tito  Martino
São Paulo  Brazil


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