[Dixielandjazz] "King Oliver" book

[Gary Lawrence Murphy]

Thanks -- there was a companion book on Kid Ory in the same vein, outside
of the discography, both seem targeted to a younger audience.

On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 10:33 AM, Marek Boym <marekboym at gmail.com> wrote:

> Difficult to tell, but Martin Williams is reliable in general.
>
> On 28 February 2013 16:52, Gary Lawrence Murphy <garym at teledyn.com> wrote:
> > Just an aside to the discussion here, I ran across a copy of Kings of
> Jazz:
> > King Joe Oliver by Martin Williams (1961) and I'm just curious where this
> > little book sits in the greater scheme of things; I'm finding it a
> > fascinating read and its anecdotes seem useful in teaching jazz history
> to
> > young teens .. assuming they are accurate, that is ;)
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Marek Boym <marekboym at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Dear Bill,
> >> Comparison on You Tube is difficult, as one canno really move back and
> >> forth without breaks.  And the no3 sound iften differs considerably
> >> from the originakl shellack (I shouldtalk - I have most of thethings
> >> on remastered vinyl records!).
> >> The case for Oliver sounds convincing - based on listening, I would
> >> definitely not have queried the trumpeter's identification as King
> >> Oliver.  I have never thought of comparing to Tommy  Dorsey.
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> On 28 February 2013 00:50, Bill Haesler <bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
> wrote:
> >> > Dear Glen, Bob and other listmates who have a passion for discography
> >> > and musical mysteries.
> >> > Ah memories.
> >> > As a young teenage jazz record collector, I started corresponding with
> >> > Walter C Allen, John RT Davies and Laurie Wright, among others.
> >> > I still have my numbered copy of Walt's King Oliver manuscript,
> >> > circulated for comment.
> >> > Also, naturally, a copy of the Laurie Wright Oliver book.
> >> > Way back then we fiercely debated the Oliver/Dorsey argument based on
> >> > the 78 records, using our ears and very little record company file
> >> > information.
> >> > And now, thanks to my friend, Christopher Cook, we are at it again.
> >> > 8>)
> >> > However, regarding Glen Page's comment:
> >> >> Clarence Williams himself was positive that it was Oliver on cornet
> and
> >> >> as Clarence put the group together and played on it he should
> >> >> know.This was reported in detail in the 1987 book and I am quite
> happy
> >> >> to accept this fact as well as the opinions of the other experts as
> given by
> >> >> Bob Smith.
> >> > On page 118 of Laurie's book regarding the 1 May 1929 session by Blind
> >> > Willie' Dunn's Gin Bottle Four, (Jet Black Blues and Blue Blood Blues
> with
> >> > composer credit to 'Johnson') he mentions that Clarence Williams was
> >> > positive that it was not one of his own dates, and that he was not the
> >> > pianist...but agreed with Ralph Venables aural identification of
> Oliver.
> >> > This was later confirmed to Walt Allen by Clarence Williams in March
> >> > 1950.
> >> > Yet Laurie Wright lists TD as a probable.
> >> > And I have always agreed, as it doesn't have the distinctive Oliver
> >> > phrasing.
> >> > And comparison with the known TD trumpet playing at that time.
> >> > Eddie Lang appears to have been the leader contractor for the date.
> And
> >> > was at the time working with the Dorsey Brothers Orchestra.
> >> > Comparison with the Clarence Williams & His Novelty Four record (which
> >> > does include King Oliver, Eddie Lang and Clarence Williams) made on 23
> >> > November 1928 for Okeh is also recommended. The tunes are "In The
> Bottle
> >> > Blues" (Williams-Lang) and "What Do You Want Me To Do?"
> (Williams-Oliver).
> >> > Refer also to pages 265-66 of Tom Lord's 1976 Clarence Williams book
> for
> >> > more comments (not the Tom Lord who publishes The Jazz Discography
> who now
> >> > accepts the Mosaic Venuti-Lang liner notes personnel).
> >> > For DJMLERs who have made it this far, the music can be heard on
> >> > YouTube.
> >> >
> >> > Jet Black Blues
> >> >    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWI-8FssvtQ
> >> >
> >> > Blue Blood Blues
> >> >    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_zC2PKiE54
> >> >
> >> > In The Bottle Blues
> >> >    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIs_eR735V4
> >> >
> >> > What Do You Want Me To Do
> >> > Still searching for an mp3 or YouTube example of this one for you all.
> >> >
> >> > Oh, how I miss the Red Hot Jazz site.
> >> > But give a gratefully thanks to all those who are uploading so many
> rare
> >> > items to YouTube for our enjoyment.
> >> >
> >> > I've just checked the Mosaic 'Joe Venuti and Eddie Lang Sessions'
> >> > booklet notes.
> >> > 'Mog' doesn't add much to the argument other than to say that it
> sounds
> >> > like TD.
> >> > Very kind regards,
> >> > Bill.
> >> > _______________________________________________
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> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
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> >>
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> >>
> >>
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Have Blog, Will Travel: blog.teledyn.com
> > A Serviceable Substitute: post.teledyn.com
> > Teledyn Addendum: teledyn.blogspot.ca
> > eso: EighthStreetOrchestra.blogspot.ca
>



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