[Dixielandjazz] If You Like Jazz History, Johnny St Cyr reminiscences

Sun Mar 27 21:40:54 PDT 2011

Dear OKOM friends

Here is a link to banjo player Johnny St Cyr reminiscences. Don´t worry, the
banjo content is not high but more is said about how the music life worked
out in early New Orleans and Chicago. 

http://www.doctorjazz.co.uk/jstcyrjj.html

I think Johnny’s memories are highly interesting. At least for me, who has
been struggling with the birth of the banjo issue in N.O jazz for many
years. It further strengthen my ideas that the African-Americans use of
banjos came in from the guitar side and in many cases stayed as guitar-banjo
playing. The white musicians brought in the four string plectrum/G-banjo
from “classic” (ragtime) banjo playing or the newly (around 1907-1908)
invented shorter scale tenor banjos from dance (tango) orchestras. Johnny’s´
remarks that he made his first guitar banjo 1914 out of a manufactured head
and a homemade neck is also very interesting. That banjo can be seen on a
photo with the Tuxedo band from 1914. There is also present a melody banjo
player, Tom Benton. He is also listed in my books as a guitar player. A
Melody banjo or Banjolin (UK name) is a mandolin-banjo all over but with
four strings only. They could easily be played by a violin player as they
share a common tuning GDAE. Smaller head Banjo-uke´s did not appear until
around 1919, at first mainly marketed and manufactured by Alvin Keech of
L.A. and London.

Here are two links to this historical interesting photo from the Tuxedo band
from 1914 or perhaps1915. You need first to log in on Yahoo.

and Banjo Collectors list;
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BanjoCollectors/photos/album/0/list

or Fourstringbanjo list;
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fourstringbanjo/photos/album/1609146986/pic/li
st

If you can’t access the photo I can send it to you. Mail me,
ulf.jagfors at telia.com . 

Comment attached by banjo historian Tony Thomas to the photo

"The 1914-15 Tuxedo Jazz Band, a group portrait: Clarence Williams (piano,
seated). Front row; Ernest "Ninesse" Trepagnier (drums), Armand J Piron
(violin), Tom Benton (guitar/melody-banjo/vocals), Johnny St. Cyr
(guitar-banjo). Standing row; Jimmy Noone (clarinet), William "Bebe" Ridgley
(trombone), Oscar Papa Celestin (cornet), Johnny Lindsay (bas). I think the
instrumentation is interesting -- the melody banjo and 6-string banjo, as
well as a clarinet and a violin. This was by many accounts (Jelly Roll,
Clarence Williams) one of the hottest N.O. dance bands before WWI. I also
want to mention (in case you didn't already know) that a similar line-up in
the Original Creole Orchestra was touring for 3-4 years before the ODJB
recorded."

The earliest recorded Jazz band (with a stiff ragtime twist) with a
plectrum/G-banjo player I am aware of is N.O origin Frisco Jass Band from
1917. The recordings can be listen to at www.redhotjazz.com.  Check out
Johnson´s Jass Blues were the plectrum banjo player really show off in long
sequences of “classic” ragtime banjo tremolos.

I also note that such a popular band like Fate Marable´s  had no banjo or
guitar player in the band until Johnny joined them. It is interesting to see
that on a picture of the Fate Marable´s Capital Revue Dance band from
1918-19 Johnny is sitting with two guitar banjos, one in his lap and the
other in front of him plus a horn. I guess one banjo  is the homemade
variant and the other is the one he bought at that time and then kept his
whole life. I wonder were that banjo is now. I have heard rumors that pieces
of it ended up in Japan, but not in  Tsumora´s now dispersed collection. See
photo at; http://www.redhotjazz.com/fateinfo.html

I was also surprised to learn to what large extent the musicians were using
written arrangements both in New Orleans and Chicago. I have for many years
had the idea that most musicians just played by ear, but that seems not to
have been the case. That early New Orleans music did not use much free solo
playing has been a known fact but the very strict use of written
arrangements was indeed a surprise. I could guess that it came from the fact
that many musicians came from marching bands which most probably used
written arrangements.

Another interesting remark from Johnny is  that they very often could not
tune up pianos to concert pitch as that could break the string frame. That
could be one reason why they mostly only had piano players in the Storeville
district. They seems to very seldom have been played with a band. The bands
were apparently playing in the more decent areas and on different social
events. Louis Armstrong ones said ” --in early N.O jazz we had no pianos but
guitars”. Much of Johnny’s recollections, specially the band playing in the
parks during the Buddy Bolden era, are rather consistent with what N.O born
Danny Barker, another  guitar-banjo player, has told in his autobiography “A
life in Jazz”. It is a pity that the fifth part of Johnny´s reminiscences,
when he returned to N.O around 1930, has not been located.  

Ulf Jaegfors

Stockholm

Från: fourstringbanjo at yahoogroups.com
[mailto:fourstringbanjo at yahoogroups.com] För John Packham
Skickat: den 27 mars 2011 12:04
Till: fourstringbanjo at yahoogroups.com
Ämne: Re: [fourstringbanjo] If You Like Jazz History

Well,,,,gee,,,thanks. That erazed some dead time on a sunday night. Most
interesting, with the added follow ons.
Read a paperback of Alan Lomax's book on Jelly Roll Morton. Most amused to
read that he knew of a character called Chicken Dick. Must have raised a
smirk or two....johnpp
----- Original Message ----- 
From: GLuetje1 at aol.com <mailto:GLuetje1%40aol.com>  
To: fourstringbanjo at yahoogroups.com
<mailto:fourstringbanjo%40yahoogroups.com>  
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 1:42 PM
Subject: [fourstringbanjo] If You Like Jazz History

I found this article today and found much of it very interesting reading, 
not so much for banjo content as for gaining context for the early days of 
jazz. And it certainly made me more aware of the musical life of Johnny 
St. Cyr.

(_http://www.doctorjazz.co.uk/jstcyrjj.html_ 
(http://www.doctorjazz.co.uk/jstcyrjj.html) )

Ginny

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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