[Dixielandjazz] drums

Thu Jan 10 09:19:39 PST 2008

As a chap who did a daily news program in English (on the equivalent of our
NPR radio) in Bogota, Colombia once said when describing some tricky news
item..... "this has opened a box of pandoras". Well, I seem to have opened
another box of pandoras with my pontificating about drum solos - actually,
they are flying around my room as I write!!

Thanks Jim, John P, Ron L and Bill for your input. Bill, I dont know what
your definition of "knobs" (....working with a bunch of knobs..) is (very
rude in English English !!) but I have to admit to having been a close
minded, purist elitist in my mis-spent youth. I am a lot more tolerant today
but still hate drum *solos* while agreeing with all of you that the drummer
is the engine room of a good band...... when he/she is playing within the
rhythm section. I have been listening to Jazz for some 60 years now, live
and recorded, and have seen just one drummer who blew me away with his solo.
The Basie Band, with Dizzie on trumpet as the star attraction, played a
concert in the mid-80's in Albuquerque - their drummer was a big (white)
fellow who played an absolutely brilliant solo that even I, with all my
prejudices, was on my feet - you could, as you say, follow the tune during
his un-accompanied solo. Sorry but I can't recollect his name.

Its an hoary old question, I know, but why is it that the great bands of the
20's and early 30's (Oliver, Armstrong, Morton, Bix, Bechet et al) seldom if
ever featured drum solos (I am talking about the days of electric
recordings) - if they had featured drum solos when playing live, would they
not have recorded with said drum solos included? If today's listeners go
bonkers with drum solos, would not our parents have done the same in the
20's and would the band leaders not have included them in their recorded
work of those times?

What say you?

Regards

Clive (with *even fewer* drummer friends !!) Smith in New York
On Jan 10, 2008 10:34 AM, <BillSargentDrums at aol.com> wrote:

> <<I am really allergic to drum solos. Why is it that audiences always  go
> bananas after the drummer has beaten the s*** out of everything
>  surrounding
> him - has a drum solo *anything* to do with music or merely an  athletic
> exercise ?? I vote for the latter, with due apologies to my (few)  drummer
> friends !!
> Clive Smith in New York>>
>
> Then Jim added:
>
> <<Clive, It's just a fact of life.   People love a loud, wild drum solo.
>  A
> drum solo can be, though, a  musical thing.  Other musicians in the band
> will
> be able to follow where  a drummer is in the actual song during his drum
> solo...if the drummer is a  musician, also (of course!).  The melody line
> can
> even be played out by  a clever drummer.
>
> I translated (into Spanish) for a drum clinic given by  Joe Morello years
> ago. Your question, Clive ("has a drum solo *anything* to  do with music")
> can be answered with a big yes.  Just takes the right  drummer.
>
> However, is that what an audience loves to hear?   Nope!  The more bashing
> &
> more crashing that goes on, the more they  seem to love it.>>
>
> Jim is right. It all depends upon the drummer. Unfortunately, Clive has
>  been
> working with a bunch of knobs . . . or, (hope this is not the case) Clive
>  is
> a closed minded purist elitist. I'm guessing it's the first scenario.
>
> There are drummers, then there are musician-drummers. Occasionally you'll
> find a musician-drummer who is also a showman. When you find that, you
> band has
> a gem. Pay him well and keep him happy. (Could also be a her) They are
> worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> They have the ability to make your band sound better than you probably
>  are.
>
> I can take a band of superb musicians in every chair and the band will
> TOTALLY SUCK if the drummer's bad.
>
> And, the reverse is also true. I can take a mediocre band, put a great
> drummer with it and it will sound wonderful.
>
> DON'T MISS THIS, BECAUSE HERE'S THE POINT: A lesson I was taught early on
>  be
> some jazz greats is -
>
> PEOPLE LISTEN AS MUCH WITH THEIR EYES AS WITH THEIR EARS.
>
> Some of you may think that's unfortunate, but it's true and it's a natural
> law that won't change just because you don't like it.
>
> In almost all cases, except for the singer, the most entertaining guy in
> your band is probably the drummer. Frankly, there's just not much
> entertainment
> value in watching a horn player's fingers move an inch or less on the keys
> or
> valves. The trombonist has an edge over the rest of you here. (I won't
> even
> touch on the washboardists here)
>
> And, without even having seen all y'all, I can safely say most of you
> stand
> or sit there like statutes.
>
> That leaves the visual entertainment to the drummer. I'll offer up my
> evidence as how Krupa won the world with Goodman. He was simply an animal.
> An
> excited, happy, smiling, moving, gestured, absorbed, wild animal . . . and
> he  was
> an attention magnet who telegraphed his enthusiasm to the audience.
>
> When I was with Clyde McCoy, I used to do a ten or so minute drum solo
>  every
> night and every night it used to bring a standing O . . . the only one in
> the show. Was it because I was a better musician than everyone else? Nope.
> It
> was because I was excited, I had learned how to be visually entertaining,
> I had
>  learned how to put together a drum solo that went somewhere and
> entertained
> . .  . and I was only 16 years old. :-)
>
> That all said, a good drummer plays music, and it there to be heard if
> your
> mind isn't filled with disdain for drummers.
>
> People tell me that when I solo, they can hear the melody of the song . .
> .
> just as Jim has mentioned.
>
> Once again, always remember - PEOPLE LISTEN AS MUCH WITH THEIR EYES AS
> WITH
> THEIR EARS.
>
>
>
> Bill
> 414-777-0100
> BillSargentBands.com
>
> Just released:  "The Best Of Bill Sargent Bands - Volume 1"
>
> Available at:  http://billsargentbands.com/recordings.htm
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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