[Dixielandjazz] Keeping Time was stylistic differences

Sat Apr 12 17:54:01 PDT 2008

In a Dixie band there are two people in charge.  The drummer is in charge of 
rhythm and the cornet player is the musical leader the instant he picks up 
his horn.  They are the 500 lb. gorilla in the room and everyone else is in 
between.

Dragging is a completely different problem.  This was a drummer (rhythm 
player) that's listening to you and reacting to you and not the other way 
around.  I think some of this comes from playing with records rather than 
with live groups.  Habits are learned young and early.  Young players often 
don't have groups to play with so they play along with recordings and never 
get the independence that is necessary.  The flip side of that of course is 
the rhythm player who has his head up his *** and doesn't listen to anyone. 
He's the guy that keeps playing four bars after everyone else quits or plays 
through breaks.

Hard as it might be to believe but everyone shouldn't be a drummer but it 
wouldn't be a bad idea for everyone to take drum lessons to learn timing.

> Makes no difference to him because he plays  on what some call "the front 
> edge of the beat" all the time.

This lets you play where ever you want and if you are in a laying back mood 
the drummer won't get even further behind which would happen if the drummer 
was following you.  If the rhythm players don't do this, the music won't 
have that energy that OKOM can have.

Musical energy is kind of hard to define because there are so many elements 
to it.  While I may not be able to exactly define it I do know it when I 
hear it and rhythm players have to play on the front edge of the beat and be 
pushing it without rushing.

I would just about bet that the whole musical energy of the group changed 
with the new guy.

I think that was the problem with my band on NYEve.  I used a drummer that I 
had played with several times before but a different bass player.  The bass 
player that I normally play with is just an excellent bass man and I suspect 
that he held this drummer in line on the previous gigs.  I thought he was an 
OK drummer.  Everything combined made a less than good job.  What happened 
is all the best guys got NYEve gigs and I booked fairly late so I got the 
left overs.  My NYEve drummer and bass player didn't keep the energy going 
and everything was kind of flat because of it.  We played tunes and we were 
OK in the eyes of our clients but I think it could have been a whole lot 
better.  It's exactly what we are talking about.
Larry
STL

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stephen G Barbone" <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
To: "Larry Walton" <larrys.bands at charter.net>
Cc: "Dixieland Jazz Mailing List" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 3:39 PM
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Keeping Time was stylistic differences

>
>> "Larry Walton  <larrys.bands at charter.net> wrote (polite snip)
>>
>> ...snip to
>> Rushing the tempo is a universal problem as I see it and it is the  most
>> wonderful thing if you have a rock solid rhythm section who is  laying 
>> down
>> the foundation for the upper instruments no matter what technique  they 
>> use.
>> ... snip to
>>
>> Rushing and holding tempo are actually complex problems that most 
>> musicians
>> have to work at especially if they have learned bad habits.  I think 
>> most
>> just don't think about it, or care and just continue doing it  forever 
>> and
>> ever causing no end of heartburn to band leaders and teachers.
>
> Amen Larry:
>
> IMO dragging is even worse than rushing. Barbone Street changed  drummers 
> last year because of tempo problems. (dragging) Our current  drummer, Mike 
> Piper, is rock steady at all tempos. Makes a huge  difference.
>
> In our band, the drummer is in charge of the time and it is up to us  to 
> work with him. Some of us solo ahead of the beat, some on the beat  and 
> some behind the beat. Makes no difference to him because he plays  on what 
> some call "the front edge of the beat" all the time.
>
> Other drummers we have worked with would slow down if a guy played  behind 
> the beat, or speed up if he played ahead of the beat.
>
> Bless the drummers who anchor the rhythm section. Makes it easy for  the 
> others to create, play around the beat and swing. And if we don't  use a 
> drummer, bless the bass who then performs the time keeping  function.
>
> The rhythm section is key to swinging as far as I'm concerned. We  horns 
> then forget  the mechanics of swing, like triplets, or dotted  8th notes 
> or whatever, that might clutter up our minds. We can just  relax, hear the 
> groove and swing along with it.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Steve Barbone
> www.myspace.com/barbonestreetjazzband
>
>
>
>
>
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