[Dixielandjazz] Stylistic differences

Sat Apr 12 11:48:59 PDT 2008

Phil. --The old New Orleans men would synchopate by lagging the beat 
slightly, by
putting a very brief rest at the start of the first measure to be
synchopated. Then they would adjust the length of the notes at the end of
the synchopated passage to get back on the beat.
________________________________________________________

I have always done this and I notice other "Ear" players do that too most of 
the time.  At least in my case I don't think it has a whole lot to do with 
manipulating the beat as much as it gives a split second to hear the chord 
and the beat and then understand where it's going and then react to it. 
Thus the common eighth rest at the beginning of measures in jazz lines.

Tempo changes may be the ultimate result.  I always understood these 
differences as "laying back" or playing "on top of the beat" or some call it 
"pushing" the beat".  This "laying back" allows the rhythm section to 
establish the beat and not be dragged by the melody or jazz line.

I think most everyone would agree that "rushing" is a universal evil and can 
easily get away from you.  I see it as being caused by people taking the 
space between notes out or shortening the space.  Lets say you are playing a 
whole line of staccato notes.  The tendency is to move them closer and 
closer together causing the tempo to pick up.  Now if we look at the 
instruments that tend to play staccato notes all the time - Banjo's and 
drums.  The backbone of the Dixie band.  Put all this together and you have 
a very real potential to rush.  This is also a manifestation of some bands 
playing everything at the same tempo no matter where it's started.  There is 
a very good band here that plays everything at tempo de tear ass.

Tempo problems caused by the failure to subdivide the beats in your head. 
Musicians, drummers especially, who have rock solid rhythm are not thinking 
quarter, quarter, quarter, etc but rather sixteenth followed by three 
sixteenth rests.  Subdivision is just not taught anywhere very much.  I 
don't do it particularly well myself.  One of the reasons for this is when 
we start on instruments we are taught that the quarter note is one count or 
beat.  The drummer who isn't hearing somewhere in his head - Tap an an an 
Tap an an an, (at slower speeds) will rush simple quarter note patterns and 
everything else too.   Then when things get tough the musicians reading / 
counting skills just falls apart.

I have taught kids for years and one of the toughest things to teach is the 
dotted quarter.  The reason is that the kids fail to see and feel (count) 
the subdivision.  Many high school players can get through band and never 
learn to play or sight read the dotted quarter or any other dotted note 
right.  Another tough place is the dotted eighth followed by a sixteenth or 
the reverse of that.  This rhythm is almost universally "swung", again 
because of the failure to understand the subdivision.

This problem extends to other music too.  How many times have you seen even 
really good musicians in a big band choke when the music says double time 
feel especially if they are sight reading?  I play with a killer big band 
here and the leader will always go over any double time or half time 
sections in rehearsal.  These guys are the best here (most are career AF 
musicians) and sometimes, even with them, there are problems without going 
through it first.  He simply doesn't do tunes with that in them if the band 
is sight reading or time is limited.  For the most part these guys are just 
simply killer sight readers.

Rushing the tempo is a universal problem as I see it and it is the most 
wonderful thing if you have a rock solid rhythm section who is laying down 
the foundation for the upper instruments no matter what technique they use.

Another thing that causes rushing when reading music and that's fear.  When 
I would spot it in my students I would explain it this way.  You are 
crossing a street and out of the corner of your eye there is a truck coming. 
As that truck bears down on you the faster you move to get out of its way. 
As it looms closer you want to run as fast as you can.  It's exactly the 
same with a crowd of black notes that you are approaching. As you get nearer 
to the hard part the more nervous you get and the faster you want to move. 
Its hard to be under fire and stay calm and what happens is the band rushes. 
It's done so often and so much that the average musician is convinced they 
don't do it until they hear the recording.

I know of only one drummer (Ken French) who can go into a studio and work 
without a click track and hold perfect tempos.  Ken retired from the Air 
Force band a few years ago and moved away from St. Louis and I lost track of 
him.  What a guy to play with.  I am pretty sure that there are several 
others here that can do the same trick but since I have never been in a 
studio with them I don't know for sure.

When I would teach the kids how to subdivide at least the beat before lets 
say a sixteenth run a lot of the problems would just go away.

Rushing and holding tempo are actually complex problems that most musicians 
have to work at especially if they have learned bad habits.  I think most 
just don't think about it, or care and just continue doing it forever and 
ever causing no end of heartburn to band leaders and teachers.
Larry
StL
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "PHIL WILKING" <philwilking at bellsouth.net>
To: "Larry Walton" <larrys.bands at charter.net>
Cc: "Dixieland Jazz Mailing List" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2008 10:04 PM
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Stylistic differences

>>  JDut953944 at aol.com asked:
>
>> Could someone explain to me the difference between the three?  I
>> was  asked
>> that question yesterday and I didn't have a clue, except I know that
>> N.O.  was
>> first.
>> Carol, Clarinet
>
> Many on this list know much more than I, especially Chris Tyle, but I find 
> that the older New Orleans jazz bandsmen  have a different synchopation 
> technique from other jazz musicians.
>
> Your typical "dixieland" front-liner will tend to jump the beat to 
> synchopate and then try to drop back to it. Unfortunately, unless the 
> drummer and other rhythm players have superhuman tempo sense, they will 
> have tended to advance the beat to try to match up with the fellow playing 
> in front of it, and the result is that the band plays faster and faster.
>
> The old New Orleans men would synchopate by lagging the beat slightly, by 
> putting a very brief rest at the start of the first measure to be 
> synchopated. Then they would adjust the length of the notes at the end of 
> the synchopated passage to get back on the beat. The rhythm section finds 
> it much easier to resist being slowed down than to resist being dragged 
> into going faster, so the result is better tempo control and a more 
> "relaxed" feel to the music.
>
> Phil Wilking
>
> Those who would exchange freedom for
> security deserve neither freedom nor security.
>
>
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