[Dixielandjazz] Something for nothing - what Larry said

[Larry Walton Entertainment - St. Louis]

I just booked a job for my duo and we charge $200 for the first hour.  The 
director of recreation told me that a local 18 piece band had been booked 
for $200 but had cancelled at the last minute.  That band has two singers 
which brings the price to $10 each for a Sunday afternoon.  That is barely 
paying for their gas.  I could see it, maybe, if they were doing sort of a 
paid rehearsal but I know for a fact that these guys practice every, yes I 
said every, Monday gig or no gig.

What's the world coming to when a 20 piece band is hustling for $200 gigs.

By the way that's another score for my advertising campaign that I started 
about a month ago.  This is another new client.  She also checked my web 
site and I got a query through it which yields her e mail address that I can 
send advertising to.

Dave also said: By Larry' standards we have a hobby band too, but I concur 
with the opinion
of many here, like Larry, who contend that musicians deserve to be
remunerated for their time,


I think I should define what I call a Hobby band.
Hobby bands tend to work like clubs that you get a membership in.  The club 
accepts you socially and as a musician.  They book jobs that may be 
vacations also like cruses or at resorts.  They have social gatherings such 
as Christmas parties and often stick together for many years with little or 
no change in basic membership.  Openings are filled because of death of a 
member or some other large change in a member's status.  Members are ousted 
only after a lot of heartburn.  Members typically do not take jobs with 
other bands.  The band may have some purpose such as donating money to 
charity.  These bands may make CD's and do other things that boost the ego 
of the members.   They may even be incorporated as non profits

Professional bands don't have memberships and are not a social club.  In 
fact members don't even have to like each other or even know the other guys 
name.  They are almost always built on the level of musicianship of the 
player.  Other considerations such as reliability are important.   Players 
take jobs with other bands.  Professional bands rarely have social 
gatherings and since there is a profit motive everything has to pay it's 
way.  These bands make CD's and do such to make money and not give some guy 
a boost at the water cooler on Monday morning.  A good example are the 
studio bands.

That's not to say that there can't be some slop between the types.  There 
are many fine professional groups that have been together for many years, 
socialize and do those other things but I don't think I have ever come 
across a hobby band that would replace a member who having been accepted by 
the group would replace him for poor playing.  I also don't know of any 
professional bands who regularly take serious hits in pay just to get a gig.

There was a big change in one of the hobby bands here a couple of months 
ago.  The leader / trumpet player married the Singer / trombone player.  No 
problem there but the Lady was obnoxious to most of the other members.  This 
could be tolerated but when she became god's wife the tension ratcheted up. 
They both left the band.  This is really rare when the leader is eased out 
of a hobby band.  There is a tenor player who has been in one of the hobby 
bands for years.  He is a good high school level player but is nowhere near 
pro level.  There are dozens of better players around but they won't replace 
him because he's in the "club".  Musicianship has nothing to do with it. 
The guy who books the musicians in this group tells me that the band gets 
better when there are a lot of subs.

Notice I haven't talked about money or overall quality of the groups.  Those 
two things can vary widely but often it comes down to money and quality. 
The instant money changes hands then the group is professional and as such 
the members should expect to make a fair return for their time.  Again fair 
varies widely depending on the area but around here is about $50-75 for an 
hour and $25 for each hour after that or about $100-$150 for a job and 
sometimes more.

I know that the 20 piece band that backed out of next Sunday's gig takes a 
lot of pride in being "professional"  ( NOT!!!) but to even suggest that $10 
a man is reasonable is not even real.  I'm almost sure that the leader will 
take $175 and pay a set up man the other $25 and the guys will play for 
free.  He also won't tell them how much they get for a gig either and lumps 
several paying gigs together and hides these no pay things.  I was in that 
band for a short time so I know how he operates.

What is a hobby band and what is a professional band is somewhat blured but 
no musician should be asked to play for so little that it's more or less 
free.  When all is said and done what can he buy after his expenses.  If the 
answer is almost nothing then you aren't getting enough for your time. 
Another guide is how much do you make for the corresponding time at your 
work counting time it takes to drive, set up and do the job then you may be 
approaching the amount then add because most jobs pay time and a half for 
overtime and weekends / holidays.

Hobby bands are here to stay but I hate to see musicians used by others who 
can pay more.  I played a gig once for a medical convention at one of the 
oldest most prestigious hotels.  There was over 1000 guests all of whom were 
in formal wear with jewels, designer gowns and furs.  Everyone there could 
have hired the band on their own with pocket change.  The leader of the band 
was a Doctor too.  Valet parking, and there was no other available, was $15 
and there was no provision for musicians.  The Pay was $50.  Needless to say 
that was the last time I played for that band but how could that leader or 
those people justify paying the band $50 a man when another dollar each 
could have paid the band very well.  Although it was a last minute job I 
should have had my head examined for taking it too but I didn't know parking 
was $15 either.

You can run the entire gammet of people from nursing homes and Seniors to 
Party's for the rich and famous.  They are all out there to get something 
for nothing especially where the musician is concerned and my gripe is that 
hobby musicians play into this relationship for reasons that does a 
disservice to everyone.
Larry
St. Louis