[Dixielandjazz] Ashes

[Larry Walton Entertainment]

Although I didn't have it all quite right I was pretty close.   The web site
that you sent http://www.rhymes.org.uk/mary_mary_quite_contrary.htm really
does tell the stories.  I studied Medieval and English history as well as
all the standard American stuff  (among others such as Revolutions, American
through Cuban) in another life, along with music.  We covered some of the
rhymes and I found it interesting.

I have had some issues with the urban legend web site before.

Anytime you are dealing with "Folk" music or art, including poetry, the
origins are sometimes very hard to trace.  Many historians totally discount
oral history.  The position taken if you don't have some hard evidence it
didn't happen.  There has been a debate for years about how far the Norsemen
got in North America and other debates center around religion.  There are
hundreds of archeologists right now looking for shreds of biblical history
to "prove" their particular viewpoint about something such as the existence
of Noah's Ark .  Personally I think it was washed up on the beach at Biloxi.
The common thread is that without direct evidence you can have differences
of opinion.

For those of you that believe the urban legend site might look at the one
Tom sent.

Larry Walton
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom Duncan" <tduncan at bellatlantic.net>
To: "'Larry Walton Entertainment'" <larrys.bands at charter.net>;
<tcashwigg at aol.com>; <jim at kashprod.com>; <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 4:48 PM
Subject: RE: [Dixielandjazz] Ashes


> Larry got a running start on "Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary", but here is a
> link with the "rest of the story"
>
> http://www.rhymes.org.uk/mary_mary_quite_contrary.htm
>
> Regards,
>
> Tom Duncan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dixielandjazz-bounces at ml.islandnet.com
> [mailto:dixielandjazz-bounces at ml.islandnet.com] On Behalf Of Larry Walton
> Entertainment
> Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 12:48 PM
> To: tcashwigg at aol.com; jim at kashprod.com; dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Ashes
>
> Actually the poem is very old and dates to the middle ages.  The poem as
to
> do with the black death that killed a quarter of the population.
>
> Ring around the rosies refers to the swelling and redness of the buboes
and
> boil like symptoms.
> Pocket full of posies refers to the flowers that you put on a grave and to
> the methods of preventing the disease.  People believed that it was
airborne
> and if you smelled good things you wouldn't get it.
> All fall down, is what happens when the disease follows it's course.
>
> Fun Huh?  There are others
>
> Mary Mary (Mary Queen of Scott's called Bloody Mary) quite contrary (she
> didn't get along with the English Queen) How does your garden grow? ( a
> reference to the fertilizer buried there) With blue bells  (the young
women
> killed?) And Cockle shells ( their
> lovers?)
> and pretty girls all in a row.  (I'm not sure but I think this refers to a
> cemetery)
> I may not have the last exactly right but it's pretty close.  Maybe some
or
> our English friends can add something.
>
> Larry Walton
> St. Louis
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <tcashwigg at aol.com>
> To: <jim at kashprod.com>; <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 12:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Ashes
>
>
> > Easy Jim:
> >
> >
> > musical content:
> >
> > Ring around the rosies
> > pocket full of posies
> > Ashes ashes all fall down !
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jim Kashishian <jim at kashprod.com>
> > To: dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> > Sent: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 11:37:55 +0200
> > Subject: RE: [Dixielandjazz] Ashes
> >
> >     The British news is going on & on about "The Ashes" which have been
> > brought
> > back to the U.K. after 18 yrs absence.  The cricket players run around
> > holding up an urn.  I, in my ignorance to the sport, wonder if it
> > really is
> > someone's ashes?
> >
> > (no musical content, but at least not political...I hope!  If someone
> > answers through DJML, you best try to spin this thread towards a musical
> > angle.  Curious as to how that can be done!!!)
> >
> > Jim
> >
> >
> > Anton wrote:
> >
> > An Aussie dirge:
> >
> > "Ashes to ashes
> > and dust to dust,
> > if the women don't get ya,
> > the Pommies must"
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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