[Dixielandjazz] Re: Jazz in Schools
Patrick Cooke
amazingbass at cox.net
Mon May 9 16:03:47 PDT 2005
What is taught (and how it is taught) in schools will, of course, vary
according to the likes, dislikes, and the performance ability of the
individual instructors. And I know that pressure is on the band director to
produce "a band that can play something"...and soon.
I don't want to paint all school band directors with a broad brush; I can
only comment on the ones I have heard, which indeed a small sample of them.
Band directors tend to teach the same way that they were taught. It
seems that the student is taught always with a sheet of music in front of
him. This is not the way to learn jazz. The band will sound good as long
as they are reading the charts, but when one of them get up to 'improvise' a
solo, the amatuerism really shows.
I remember hearing one such student band at a festival, and the band
director took a trumpet solo....he didn't sound much better than the kids!
I remember once having dinner with two old high school chums who went
on to be school band directors. I mentioned one of our old classmates who
became quite a good jazz performer, but wasn't much of a section player,
which was their main bag.. Both of these band director friends could read
anything, but neither could fake a four bar introduction to Twinkle Twinkle.
They dismissed the accomplished jazz artist with "Oh, he's 'just' a jazz
player. These the mindsets of some of the people 'teaching' jazz. It seems
that some of the students eventually wind up being good jazz players in
spite of their teachers.
As I said in the opening, I know a number of band directors who are
excellent musicians in both jazz and legit. But there are a number that
will just narrow their focus in the the rush to have "a band that can play
something by the first football game."
Pat Cooke
----- Original Message -----
From: <dixielandjazz-request at ml.islandnet.com>
To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 2:00 PM
Subject: Dixielandjazz Digest, Vol 29, Issue 18
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. FW: [Dixielandjazz] Jazz & Poetry--the 50s (Jim Kashishian)
> 2. Sacto tix and programs (John Pendleton)
> 3. Re: Jazz & Poetry--the 50s (Charles Suhor)
> 4. Guess the piano man (Gary Kiser)
> 5. Re: Nursing Home Gigs and the Impact of Music (Bill Haesler)
> 6. Playing in Nursing Homes/Assisted Living etc. (Steve barbone)
> 7. Playing with 10 year old Jonathan Russell today (Steve barbone)
> 8. Tony Orr- Steve Wadell in OZ (eighthst7 at aol.com)
> 9. Re: Tony Orr- Steve Wadell in OZ (Bill Haesler)
> 10. Re: Sacto tix and programs (Robert S. Ringwald)
> 11. Successful school jazz program-not modern jazz (Charles Suhor)
> 12. address wanted (Hans Koert)
> 13. San Diego Traditional Jazz (Myrna/Jim Goodwin)
> 14. Re: RV Parking at Sacramento (Don)
> 15. Antique Washboards (Robert S. Ringwald)
> 16. StreetBand list and BadAss Brass Tribe (Not exactly OKOM but
> maybe of interest to some) (David Richoux)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 21:03:44 +0200
> From: "Jim Kashishian" <jim at kashprod.com>
> Subject: FW: [Dixielandjazz] Jazz & Poetry--the 50s
> To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID:
> <mailman.0.1115665205.79083.dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>
> This Beatnik era talk brings back memories of my "coffe house" days. The
> early-on South Frisco Jazz Band played at the Rouge Et Noir coffee house
> in
> Seal Beach, California in the late '50's. We thought, at the time, that
> it
> was a laugh to have a young 6 piece jazz band blasting away in a coffee
> house instead of the usual bass & poet act.
>
> It was extremely successful. We were 3 doors up Main Street from the
> ocean,
> and this beach town rocked on the 4 nights a week we played. The gig
> lasted
> a good while, and we developed into a fairly tight group during that
> period.
>
>
> No booze in the joint, which was good 'cause some of us were underage. It
> wasn't until we moved to the Costa Mesa "Honeybucket" bar that the coppers
> checked my ID & that was the end of my time with the band...from
> conception
> in 1955 to 1960.
>
> After that, the Air Force Bands, Madrid, etc.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 12:14:54 -0700 (PDT)
> From: John Pendleton <jwpen2003 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Sacto tix and programs
> To: dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> Message-ID: <20050508191454.6479.qmail at web51710.mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> I've heard that the Hawthorne Suites are offering
> their Sac Jubilee guests all-event badges at the
> discounted price of $80, which includes the Jubilee
> program.
> How common is this? Does the Jubilee co-sponsor or
> underwrite this?
>
> John Pendleton
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Mail
> Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
> http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 14:26:00 -0500
> From: Charles Suhor <csuhor at zebra.net>
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Jazz & Poetry--the 50s
> To: jim at kashprod.com
> Cc: dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> Message-ID: <128ce58e57b6a55a219cecca997da406 at zebra.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
> On May 8, 2005, at 2:03 PM, Jim Kashishian wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> This Beatnik era talk brings back memories of my "coffe house" days.
>> The
>> early-on South Frisco Jazz Band played at the Rouge Et Noir coffee
>> house in
>> Seal Beach, California in the late '50's. We thought, at the time,
>> that it
>> was a laugh to have a young 6 piece jazz band blasting away in a coffee
>> house instead of the usual bass & poet act.
>>
>> It was extremely successful. We were 3 doors up Main Street from the
>> ocean,
>> and this beach town rocked on the 4 nights a week we played. The gig
>> lasted
>> a good while, and we developed into a fairly tight group during that
>> period.
>>
>>
>> No booze in the joint, which was good 'cause some of us were underage.
>> It
>> wasn't until we moved to the Costa Mesa "Honeybucket" bar that the
>> coppers
>> checked my ID & that was the end of my time with the band...from
>> conception
>> in 1955 to 1960.
>>
>> After that, the Air Force Bands, Madrid, etc.
>>
>> Jim
>>
> You were there in the beginnings, for sure. Those of us who were
> underage and lucky in those days didn't fall into the drug scene and
> had access to some special musical and cultural experiences with little
> fear of being carded. By the time that police and club owners got to
> checking ID's I was well into my 30s.
>
> Charlie
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Dixielandjazz mailing list
>> Dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
>> http://ml.islandnet.com/mailman/listinfo/dixielandjazz
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 22:55:06 +0200
> From: Gary Kiser <gary at kiser.org>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Guess the piano man
> To: DJML <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>, Jazz Muso List
> <jazzmusiciansforum at JazzMusiciansForum.talklist.com>
> Message-ID: <427E7CAA.7060409 at kiser.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> Guess the piano man (click here
> <http://www.monkzone.com/realaudio/chopin.rm>). I'm not sure Chopin
> would have approved. Doesn't really matter; he's dead. But, so is the
> pianist for that matter. And, at that same moment, a man changed his
> socks in Melbourne -- coincidence; I think not.
>
> All the best, Gary
>
> Gary Kiser
> www.sacapulses.com
> www.mojobrassband.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 08:21:56 +1000
> From: Bill Haesler <bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re: Nursing Home Gigs and the Impact of
> Music
> To: Janie McCue Lynch <janie51 at socal.rr.com>, dixieland jazz mail list
> <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <BEA4CE24.85D0%bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>> I always carve out the time to
> share these few meaningful minutes with him.<
>
> Good for you Jane!
> Another side to the 'coin'.
> Jazz is, indeed, for sharing.
> Very kind regards,
> Bill.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 19:16:55 -0400
> From: Steve barbone <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Playing in Nursing Homes/Assisted Living etc.
> To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <BEA41627.2685%barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> "Janie McCue Lynch" <janie51 at socal.rr.com> wrote (polite snip)
>
>> Gus, what a great letter and such a good thought about your performances
>> often being the highlight of a long term care facility resident's month.
>> Music has an impact on so many, many of us.
>>
>> One gentleman in particular wouldn't respond to me no matter what I
>> said...until
>
> Right on Janie. We play at several Assisted Living/Nursing Home facilities
> on a donation basis every December. Usually a quartet. They are freebies
> to
> the facilities, though I pay the sidemen $50 each for an hour.
>
> Most memorable?
>
> An elderly gentleman had not uttered a word for several years, so the
> chief
> nurse told me. He just sat and stared. We play familiar tunes at these
> events and started on "My Blue Heaven". Somehow that made a connection and
> the old guy started to sing it. He sang it perfectly.
>
> Very moving experience. The more of them we play, the more we find out
> that
> music makes a connection to these people, when mere words or actions do
> not.
>
> Our band is very much uplifted at these, even when we might be playing for
> just 20 people in wheel chairs, roller beds, etc. They don't demonstrate
> much, but you can see the gratitude in their eyes and when a familiar face
> is there a year later, you can see the happy recognition at our arrival.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve Barbone
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 21:42:16 -0400
> From: Steve barbone <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Playing with 10 year old Jonathan Russell
> today
> To: DJML <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <BEA43838.268C%barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Just back from a May Arts Festival gig with 10 year old jazz violinist
> Jonathan Russell. Wow, he has improved since we last played with him in
> 2004
> and he was no slouch back then.
>
> Best part was trading with him on I Got Rhythm. We first split the melody
> in
> chorus between him (violin) and me (clarinet). 2 bars each.
>
> I got rhythm (Violin)
> I got music (Clarinet
> I got my man (Violin)
> Who could ask for anything more (Clarinet). ETC, through the chorus.
>
> Then, the real highlight. After full chorus solos, we traded Eights and
> then
> Fours. This time I went first. Using simple improvisation which he copied.
> Hmmmm. OK
>
> Little more complex improv . .which he copied. Hmmmm. OK, so the kid wants
> to play eh?
>
> Now getting into serious improv. He didn't copy exactly, but paraphrased
> and
> added some relevant improv of his own. Sneaky kid.
>
> The audience could see me smiling and digging what this 10 year old kid
> was
> doing. The tougher I got, the tougher he got.
>
> WHAT A BLAST. AND THE JAZZ OBLIVIOUS GENERAL AUDIENCE GOT IT. EVEN BEFORE
> I
> REMARKED ABOUT IT AFTER THE NUMBER WAS OVER. EVERYBODY WAS SMILING AND
> NODDING, YEAH. (Rooting for the kid)
>
> Tip for those who might be playing with him this year. He can improv
> better
> than a lot of players on the circuit and if you hold back on trades, he'll
> cut you to ribbons. :-) VBG.
>
> Or, if you are not a good improviser, let him go first. :-) VBG.
>
> I can hardly wait for the next batch of concerts with him this Summer. I
> believe Ed Polcer in New York City has been teaching him how to trade
> Twos,
> Fours, Eights etc and how to hear the preceding improv and build on it. OK
> kid, look out, I'm dusting off my "Bird Licks" and "Tony Scott"
> variations.
> No more Mr. Nice Guy. :-) VBG.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve Barbone
>
> PS. Damn, I hope he doesn't learn the "Picou Obbligato" on High Society.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 21:52:42 EDT
> From: eighthst7 at aol.com
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Tony Orr- Steve Wadell in OZ
> To: dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> Message-ID: <d.43e5c3d9.2fb01c6a at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> I am trying to connect with these guys from the Creole Bells band. Dick
> Redmond in Palm Springs CA.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 14:01:38 +1000
> From: Bill Haesler <bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re: Tony Orr- Steve Wadell in OZ
> To: <eighthst7 at aol.com>, dixieland jazz mail list
> <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <BEA51DC2.85E7%bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>> I am trying to connect with these guys from the Creole Bells band. Dick
> Redmond in Palm Springs CA.<
>
> Answered off list.
> Regards,
> Bill.
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 21:23:47 -0700
> From: "Robert S. Ringwald" <robert at ringwald.com>
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Sacto tix and programs
> To: "DJML" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <00f901c5544f$8d7c72a0$5702fea9 at laptop1>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> John Pendleton jwpen2003 at yahoo.com asks;s:
>
>> I've heard that the Hawthorne Suites are offering
>> their Sac Jubilee guests all-event badges at the
>> discounted price of $80, which includes the Jubilee
>> program.
>> How common is this? Does the Jubilee co-sponsor or
>> underwrite this?
>
>
> I am not involved with that part of the Jubilee promotion. But I will
> offer
> a guess. It is probably part of a package promotion deal. There are many
> of those including the group ticket price offered to DJML members by the
> Jubilee group ticket sales chairman, & DJML Listmate Jim Fusaro.
>
> We have announced it 3 or 4 times this year here on DJML. 15% off on all
> events badges for DJML members. Contact Jim Fusaro, jim4jazz at comcast.net.
>
> --Bob Ringwald
> Placerville, CA USA
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 01:35:41 -0500
> From: Charles Suhor <csuhor at zebra.net>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Successful school jazz program-not modern
> jazz
> To: DJML Jazz <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <4fb967ffd34e7421ad28e9077dad408a at zebra.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
> Hello, Listmates,
>
> We've been writing about the fact that school-based programs lacking
> interest in early jazz--that there's little actual teaching of playing
> non-modern jazz, just treatment of it in jazz history programs. I
> mentioned that early jazz styles, like blues and country and Western
> and rock & roll, aren't in the curriculum because they aren't regarded
> by most educational leaders as high art but as folk or popular music.
>
> The view is that these kinds of music are pursued by hobbyists and a
> few specialized professionals who learn the music via popular culture,
> outside of school contexts. Of course, that was also the view of big
> band and modern jazz until it was grudgingly and gradually brought into
> school programs in acknowledgment of its complexity and teachability in
> academic terms of chord-based improvisation, reading skill, and speed,
> range, and other technical aspects.
>
> There is an interesting breakthrough in the teaching of the
> once-anathema blues music in Alabama schools. It has been going on for
> quite a while, apparently with good results and recognition. I know
> that several listmates have done good things in schools, and maybe this
> will give some ideas about grants and further "infiltration," if that's
> a good word for it. Visit the website of the highly successful Alabama
> Blues Project at http://www.alabamablues.org/state.htm
>
> It seems to me that the Ala. group had a good handle to get the thing
> funded, namely, the strong blues tradition in the state's history--a
> cultural foot-in-the-door. But notice this: the whole program is not
> curricular, but after-school. It's not accorded the value of credit
> courses, and apparently it's not in the colleges at all. Half empty,
> half full in a very small glass, but it's an interesting model that
> might be expanded there and applied to other kinds of music in
> different places.
>
> I personally feel that teaching of early jazz styles should have
> greater priority in school programs than other musics that haven't made
> it into Academe.
>
> Charlie Suhor
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 12:56:57 +0200
> From: "Hans Koert" <koerthchkz at zeelandnet.nl>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] address wanted
> To: "Dixieland list" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>, "78-L at 78online.
> Com" <78-l at 78online.com>
> Message-ID: <NCENLKCFGPCALEEOECFLOENPCPAA.koerthchkz at zeelandnet.nl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Has someone the (email) address of Ean Wood, author of the 2000 "Josephine
> Baker Story"?
> If you like you can contact me off-list.
>
> Keep swinging
>
> Hans Koert
>
> El Redescubrimiento de Oscar Alemán project
> http://www.people.zeelandnet.nl/koerthchkz
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 08:13:57 -0700
> From: "Myrna/Jim Goodwin" <goodwinhawkins at cox.net>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] San Diego Traditional Jazz
> To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <00b601c554a9$b9548f20$b6fe0744 at your0loco35imu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
> This Sunday (5/15/05) America's Finest City Dixieland Jazz Society meets
> 1:00 pm to 4:00 pm at the El Cajon Elks Lodge, 1400 East Washington Ave.,
> El Cajon, CA. The featured band for the 3 hours concert is the Red
> Pepper Jazz Band. http://www.dixielandjazzfestival.org/Monthly.html
>
> There is a large dance floor, a full bar, and lots of free parking.
> Admission $10, members $7, under 22--$5.
>
> Kelly Hawkins
> San Diego, CA
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 09:39:20 -0700
> From: Don <jdrobertson at att.net>
> Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] RV Parking at Sacramento
> To: jobriant at garlic.com
> Cc: Dixielandjazz List <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <427F9238.4050406 at att.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Jim,
>
> We have been taking our RV to Cal Expo for many years now. This works
> out great for us, but since there are MANY rigs there, and it's not a
> dedicated RV park, they string temporary power cables all over the
> RVparking area. They have always told us, via the handouts when we get
> there, that the power is insufficient for air conditioners, particularly
> if everyone ran theirs at once. So I guess the bottom line is don't
> expect to run your AC. We have a small rig, 23' Toyota chassis, which
> does have a moderate sized AC, but we have been hot and cold over the
> years. If it's hot we spend a lot of time in the hotel venues.
> However, this year, unless there is a major change in the next 3 weeks,
> it's not so apt to be really hot. In fact it may still be raining. One
> year it rained like hell the whole weekend. There are other RV parks in
> and around Sacramento, but not served by shuttle busses.
>
> Don Robertson
> Napa, CA
>
> Jim O'Briant wrote:
>
>>Have any of you ever used the RV Parking area at the CalExpo grounds for
>>the
>>Sacramento Jazz Jubilee?
>>
>>When we made reservations in early January, we were told that there we
>>would
>>be in one of 100 sites that have both water and either 30 amp or 50 amp
>>electric hookups. But today we got a form letter saying that to have
>>electricity, we needed 150 feed of 14 gauge electric cord and a 15-amp
>>plug.
>>With the possibility of high temperatures, we're really not interested in
>>going if we can't be comfortable, and 15 amps won't run one RV air
>>conditioner, much less both of them.
>>
>>Can anyone shed more light on the exact situation regarding RV hookups --
>>that is, electrical amperage and water supply?
>>
>>(If conditions turn out to be not as promised to me on the phone in
>>January,
>>there may be a couple of four-day passes for sale!)
>>
>>Jim O'Briant
>>Gilroy, CA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Dixielandjazz mailing list
>>Dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
>>http://ml.islandnet.com/mailman/listinfo/dixielandjazz
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:51:31 -0700
> From: "Robert S. Ringwald" <robert at ringwald.com>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Antique Washboards
> To: "DJML" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <00d101c554c0$5fcad6f0$5702fea9 at laptop1>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Our former Listmate Bill Horton, asked me to post the following:
>
> (snip)
>> > my neighbor has about 20 antique washboards for sale and wondered if
>> > any
>> > DJMLers were interested in one or more.
> (snip)
>
> You may contact Bill at williamhorton at peoplepc.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 11:26:05 -0700
> From: David Richoux <tubaman at batnet.com>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] StreetBand list and BadAss Brass Tribe (Not
> exactly OKOM but maybe of interest to some)
> To: DJML Jazz <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Message-ID: <866be7d11784001c685d5528bdf1b7be at batnet.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
> Hi All,
>
> While doing research for my next radio special I just found out about
> this YahooGroup:
> ( http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/StreetBand/ ) and a Tribe.net
> group called Badass Brass
> ( http://baddassbrass.tribe.net/) . They are both focused on the new
> energetic revival of brasswind "Street Performance" groups all over the
> world. If you are interested in exploring "further out there" brass
> music styles I think you will find both of these lists of interest.
>
> New Orleans Brass Band styles are discussed, along with a lot of other
> things. Probably Not for the TRADitionalists ;-)
>
> Don't forget - my next special on KFJC ( www.kfjc.org ) will be on this
> kind of music - Thursday May 19th 10am-2pm PDT
>
> Dave Richoux
> KFJC Jazz Parade
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Dixielandjazz mailing list
> Dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> http://ml.islandnet.com/mailman/listinfo/dixielandjazz
>
>
> End of Dixielandjazz Digest, Vol 29, Issue 18
> *********************************************
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