[Dixielandjazz] Re: So bad it must be shared.......

[Beth Villanyi]

Jeez Larry, wouldn't it have been easier just to say the joke was referring 
to a Bb minor chord and not three different minor keys?

My head is spinning!

Beth

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "LARRY'S Signs and Large Format Printing" <sign.guy at charter.net>
To: "Robert Smith" <robert.smith at mitransport.no>; "Dixieland Jazz" 
<dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2004 4:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Re: So bad it must be shared.......


> Bob -
> The spelling of a minor chord is 3 half steps(minor third)  on the bottom
> with 4 half steps(major third) on top. A major chord is the opposite with 
> 4
> half steps between the root and third and 3 half steps between the third 
> and
> the fifth.  An example is the Bb minor chord.  Count them Bb (root), B, C,
> Dflat (3) (third)  Dflat, D, D#, E, F(fifth) (4)  Hence a Bb minor chord.
>
> The joke refers to chord spacing and the notes that are associated with 
> the
> chord symbol.  While it is true that chords are usually spelled in
> accordance with the scale that they are associated with jazz musicians
> rarely use some chord spellings.  Although for example C flat may be the
> correct spelling in some keys most guitar players would do a double take 
> if
> you wrote it for them.  The same is true of many of the flat Chords. 
> Common
> usage is that chords like Gb, Cb,  E#, B# are almost never used even 
> though
> they are technically correct at times.
>
> To simplify things Jazz writers will almost always choose a Bb chord 
> rather
> than an A# even though the A# may be technically correct in some keys.
> Don't confuse the chord symbol with the scale.
>
> While it is true that the classical spelling of the chords based on the
> scale tones of the scale is technically correct that's not what happens in
> common usage.  In classical music they used Roman Numerals as figured bass
> to denote the chord.  Roman numerals are always technically correct but 
> are
> difficult to read so jazz musicians came up with chord symbols.  A III mi
> chord in the key of C is an Emi in chord symbols while a III mi in A is a 
> CO
> chord so the musician had to translate each time.  Roman numerals and
> figured bass are correct are best for chordal analysis of music.  Chord
> symbols on the other hand are almost useless for analysis of a piece of
> music because they are used in a wishy washy way.  (On the other hand 
> that's
> the way most of us Jazz musicians are.)  If you think this is all 
> confusing
> try Sofeggi.
>
> A good example is the way  computers sometimes put in accidentals.  I have
> seen an E# (the note) followed by an F ( or a Gb followed by an F# etc) in
> the same measure.  This might be technically correct but it makes sight
> reading tough and fills the tunes with needless mistakes.  Follow the KISS
> principle when writing. ( Keep It Simple Stupid.)
>
> I would have picked a different chord for the joke.
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Robert Smith" <robert.smith at mitransport.no>
> To: "Dixieland Jazz" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2004 3:03 PM
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re: So bad it must be shared.......
>
>
> Ed Danielsen relayed this joke:
>>A B-flat, a D-flat, and an F walk into a bar. The
>>bartender says to them, "I'm sorry we don't serve minors here"...
>>
>>So the D-flat leaves and the B-flat and the F have
>>a fifth between them and go home.
>>
>
> There is a minor mistake in the joke that in fact is a major mistake.
> D-flat is in fact a major key with five flats. The key of D-flat minor
> would, in fact have eight flats, which, though not impossible, is
> cumbersome, and traps the unwary with F-flat and C-flat.
> The minor key related to D-flat major is C-sharp minor having five sharps.
> There is no recognised key of C-sharp major because there would be both F
> and F-sharp plus C and C-sharp in the same scale.
>
> So the joke ought to be ....
>
> Cheers
>
> Bob Smith
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