[Dixielandjazz] Re: Rifle Rangers/1919 Rag

Dan Augustine ds.augustine at mail.utexas.edu
Thu Nov 27 20:57:20 PST 2003

     So nobody believes the information i posted on Nov. 24th?  Turk 
even talks about it on the recording, and about how hard the original 
French title is to pronounce.
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 17:49:35 -0600
To: DJML <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
From: Dan Augustine <ds.augustine at mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re: 1919 Rag

Don and DJML--
     I looked through my recordings by Turk and Lu, and found a Turk 
Murphy CD called "Jazz Casual--Turk Murphy/Muggsy Spanier" (Koch Jazz 
KOC CD-8569, 1995). This was from a 1960's TV show originally 
recorded on June 20, 1962.
     The first song is "1919 Rag", and in the liner-notes this is 
listed underneath the song: "Michel Jouve-Frank Terran  BMI Woodchuck 
Music Inc.". Maybe they are the arrangers, not the composers, who 
knows.  This is the only information (other than "Trad. (P. D.)") 
i've found.

>From: "Mike Durham" <mikedurham_jazz at hotmail.com>
>To: bhaesler at bigpond.net.au, mophandl at landing.com,
>	dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
>Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Re: Rifle Rangers/1919 Rag
>Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 00:01:52 +0000
>Bill, don, everone: having downloaded the Rifle Rangers music from 
>Dick Baker, I agree the first two themes are totally different from 
>the tune we know as 1919 Rag/March, but the trio strain is very 
>similar. But then, there are several old tunes with a similar trio 
>melody/chord sequence (Buddy's Habit and Chattanooga Stomp spring to 
>mind) so the opportunities for confusion were probably always high. 
>This of course leaves us with the question of who wrote 1919! 
>Anybody got any clues??
>Mike D.
>>From: Bill Haesler <bhaesler at bigpond.net.au>
>>To: Don Mopsick <mophandl at landing.com>,DJML <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
>>Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re:  Rifle Rangers/1919 Rag
>>Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 10:33:09 +1100
>>Dear Don,
>>I have kept out of this thread, as I had nothing to add.
>>I tried to track it all down years ago, without any success.
>>Have just checked aurally the 3 issued versions of Kid Ory's '1919
>>Rag/March' against his version of 'Rifle Rangers'.
>>All the same tune.
>>Its sounds as if it may be an old (and incorrect) New Orleans myth that
>>'1919 = Rifle Rangers'.
>>Hopefully you will get to the core of it.
>>Dick Baker's post with the music was a great help too, although my reading
>>skills have dimmed a lot since I retired from the Williamstown City Brass
>>Band in 1953.
>>I have given a copy of this music to my jazz-brother, cltist John 'Darkie'
>>McCarthy (he lives up the road) for comment.
>>Very kind regards,
>>PS: I know (from the LP sleeves) that Lu and Turk said that Bunk taught them
>>the '1919' tune. It seems more logical to me that it was the Kid.
>>Just a thought, as they also knew him quite well from the 1940s on.
>>Bunk never (to my knowledge) played or recorded '1919'.
>>Ory did.

**  Dan Augustine     Austin, Texas     ds.augustine at mail.utexas.edu  **
**     "If other people are going to talk, conversation becomes       **
**      impossible."  -- James McNeill Whistler                       **

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