[Dixielandjazz] ODJB

[Mike Durham]

Anything Bechet said on the subject of tune theft should possibly be taken 
with a pinch of salt - his "Coffee Grinder" is note-for-note "Rubber Plant 
Rag" from about 1908. Let's be charitable and put it down to a lapse of 
memory on his part. After all, the great Louis 'composed' "Someday You'll Be 
Sorry" but it is identical to a tune called "Good Night, Sweetheart" from 
some years earlier - unconscious plagiarism, probably, since Louis said the 
melody came to him in a dream. Not sure where this is going, so I'll stop!

Mike.


>From: Stephen Barbone <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: barbonestreet at earthlink.net
>To: Mike Durham <mikedurham_jazz at hotmail.com>
>CC: dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
>Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] ODJB
>Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:22:28 -0500
>
>Mike Durham wrote: (polite snip)
>
> > As for your suggestion they stole even the
> > tunes, well that may be going a bit far. Have you ever read of anyone 
>else
> > claiming At The Jazz Band Ball, or Sensation, or Bluin' the Blues, or
> > Ostrich Walk, or Clarinet Marmalade, or all the other ODJB compositions 
>(OK
> > I know Tiger Rag probably predates them) or seen any documented proof 
>the
> > tunes were pirated? Seems that wholesale theft on that scale would have 
>been
> > a well-publicised scandal by now.
>
>Hi Mike:
>
>I did not say their was "wholesale theft". Yes I have read of others 
>claiming
>that these tunes were the same (in whole or in part) as performed by other
>bands during the time. One example is Livery Stable Blues a/k/a Barnyard 
>Blues.
>The foremost example I can think of regarding possible copyrighting of 
>existing
>tunes came directly to me via spoken word of Sidney Bechet circa 1955. He 
>made
>that claim (Livery Stable) not only to me, but to others and it appears in
>several books about him. That of course does not make it the truth, but 
>merely
>answers your question of "have I read" etc.
>
>That kind of thing was/is quite common in jazz. W. C. Handy has been 
>accused of
>"stealing" many of the Blues he copyrighted, including St. Louis Blues. And
>through the years, many such accusations are made essentially that the 
>folks
>who copyrighted the tunes were just smart enough to claim composer credit 
>first
>and that many of the tunes were being played previously in part or entirely 
>by
>other bands and could be classified as "traditional"
>
> > So at least we can thank them for that
> > particular contribution to our repertoire. Just a little plea for
> > tolerance....
>
>If I am intolerant of ODJB, I will try and mend my ways, I certainly do not
>intend to convey that impression. I value their contribution to the history 
>of
>jazz. After all, they popularized it by being the first to record it and
>getting mass distribution, as was possible to do so, in the early part of 
>the
>20th century. I am just stating that of all the many forms of OKOM, theirs 
>is
>not a viable form today while the others are. And theirs ceased being 
>popular
>very quickly, except as cartoon music in the movies.
>
>Regarding the fact that Levinson makes a CD now and then in the style is 
>simply
>validation that anything mankind does, or has done, will find a zealous
>collector or small group of collectors somewhere on the planet. For 
>example, I
>read of a guy who has a very valuable collection of human excrement, 
>preserved
>in "artistic" form.
>
>Darn,  I have flushed away a fortune during my 70 years. ;-)
>
>Cheers,
>Steve Barbone
>
>

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