[Dixielandjazz] Re: Dixielandjazz digest, Vol 1 #403 - 17 msgs

Sat, 4 Jan 2003 09:05:33 EST

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In a message dated 1/4/2003 7:04:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, 
dixielandjazz-request@ml.islandnet.com writes:

> Due in part to the DC area community of musicians one chooses
> from: so many of the musicians sprang from "modern" jazz to one extent or
> another, that many of them couldn't sound like authentic OKOM to save their
> lives; they use modernish chords, tend to play a more "cool" and technical
> style, and in a group they follow more modern rules, eg the bass and drums
> are the equal of the horns; the piano is basically one-handed and many
> pianists couldn't provide rhythm to save their lives; the drummers insist
> on using the ride cymbal rather than high-hat for "In the mood" etc., and
> they tend to use a post-1950 Basie band style that bumps and clatters
> a-rhythmatically, quite antithetical to smooth, straight 4/4 rhythm that
> supports both horns and dancers. And they don't know the old music at all
> well enough to relate to instructions intended to put them on the right
> path... 
> 

Dan Spink Adds His Two Cents (Again);

Sheik: You have summed up my lifelong problem with so-called modern jazz 
beautifully; especially when you talk about the piano being a one-handed 
instrument that never provides rhythm. What amazes me is that all the little 
clubs and restaurants you go to in my neck of the woods (the northeast around 
New York) that claim to offer "jazz" have a small combo (4 to 5 players and 
one is often a vocalist) doing exactly this kind of stuff.  I heard the same 
sounds (and often the same tunes) in the late fifties when I played in dance 
bands when I wasn't playing Dixie. But here's the big puzzle to me. When you 
hear the experts on Jazz history talk about the great innovators like Monk, 
Gillespie and Davis, etc., etc., they almost always talk about the technical 
level of musicianship these guys brought. That's what I thought real bop and 
cool jazz required. Then I watch these "jazz groups" stumbling along with 
fake books playing Fly Me To The Moon in Eb and I wonder. Have I been had? Is 
Bop and all that musicianship talk really what these guys are about? Please! 
Give me Bill Bailey in F or Bb any time.

Dan (piano fingers) Spink

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<HTML><BODY BGCOLOR="#3dffff">In a message dated 1/4/2003 7:04:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, dixielandjazz-request@ml.islandnet.com writes: 
 
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Due in part to the DC area community of musicians one chooses 
from: so many of the musicians sprang from "modern" jazz to one extent or 
another, that many of them couldn't sound like authentic OKOM to save their 
lives; they use modernish chords, tend to play a more "cool" and technical 
style, and in a group they follow more modern rules, eg the bass and drums 
are the equal of the horns; the piano is basically one-handed and many 
pianists couldn't provide rhythm to save their lives; the drummers insist 
on using the ride cymbal rather than high-hat for "In the mood" etc., and 
they tend to use a post-1950 Basie band style that bumps and clatters 
a-rhythmatically, quite antithetical to smooth, straight 4/4 rhythm that 
supports both horns and dancers. And they don't know the old music at all 
well enough to relate to instructions intended to put them on the right 
path... 
</BLOCKQUOTE> 
 
Dan Spink Adds His Two Cents (Again); 
 
Sheik: You have summed up my lifelong problem with so-called modern jazz beautifully; especially when you talk about the piano being a one-handed instrument that never provides rhythm. What amazes me is that all the little clubs and restaurants you go to in my neck of the woods (the northeast around New York) that claim to offer "jazz" have a small combo (4 to 5 players and one is often a vocalist) doing exactly this kind of stuff.&nbsp; I heard the same sounds (and often the same tunes) in the late fifties when I played in dance bands when I wasn't playing Dixie. But here's the big puzzle to me. When you hear the experts on Jazz history talk about the great innovators like Monk, Gillespie and Davis, etc., etc., they almost always talk about the technical level of musicianship these guys brought. That's what I thought real bop and cool jazz required. Then I watch these "jazz groups" stumbling along with fake books playing Fly Me To The Moon in Eb and I wonder. Have I been had? Is Bop and all that musicianship talk really what these guys are about? Please! Give me Bill Bailey in F or Bb any time. 
 
Dan (piano fingers) Spink</HTML>

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