[Dixielandjazz] Hold Harmless Agreements

Mon, 16 Dec 2002 16:46:26 +1000

The problem with any agreement is that they impair the success of your
own insurer (yes we all need liability insurance) recovering from a
hirer who denies liability. Sign nothing except your own insurer's
documents. I regularly cross out the bad bits and return them to the
hirer. I have never heard a complaint. I think it is an "in house"
clause so I tell them to ask their lawyer if it's ok. London to a brick
you will hear nothing else from them. I got insurance after my horn
caught a ceiling fan at a gig, the blade fell from the fan and landed in
a guest's lap. Fortunately no damage was done but imagine if !!!!!! 

Richard Stevens
www.ozemail.com.au/~jazzfact/

-----Original Message-----
From: dixielandjazz-admin@ml.islandnet.com
[mailto:dixielandjazz-admin@ml.islandnet.com] On Behalf Of David W.
Littlefield
Sent: Monday, 16 December 2002 11:32 AM
To: dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Hold Harmless Agreements

When we worked the various DC area Hyatt Hotels via their local booking
agency, we signed 2 contracts: one was for the gig re the client. The
other
was a "hold harmless" agreement with the hotel, and a line or two
specifically referred to that which was not caused by the hotel's
negligence, which made it seem quite acceptable. I don't have any
copies,
but you might be able to get a copy from a Hyatt catering office. I
believe
I've only had to sign one other during my career...

--Sheik

At 10:09 PM 12/15/2002 +0000, you wrote:
>Hi listmate, and Steve Barbone especially,
>
>I recall Steve posting a note last year sometime regarding a gig where
the 
>venue manager attempted to make Steve sign a "hold harmless agreement."
This 
>is a contract wherein if the musician is injured on the gig and it's
the 
>fault of the venue, the venue will not be held liable by the musician.
As I 
>recall, Steve responded to the effect that he would never sign a
document 
>giving up his legal right to sue negligent venue operators for damages.
He 
>tore up the contract and cancelled the gig. I think I recalled the
salient 
>facts . . . is that sorta correct, Steve?
>
>Anyway, last night I play drums in a trio with Bob Ringwald on piano
and Jim 
>Lenhart on bass. We were booked by a company in California to play this
gig 
>at the Cal-Neva Casino at Stateline, Nevada. It was an annual awards
dinner 
>for this particular company and they had booked the facilities of the
casino 
>for the gig. We (the trio) were paid well and the gig included a room
for 
>each musician for the night.
>
>As we got off the elevator where the room was located in which we were
to 
>play, a young lady informed us that we would not be allowed to play
unless 
>we all had signed a "hold harmless agreement."  Of course we were
floored by 
>the announcement and I asked the lady if Frank Sinatra (who once owned
the 
>casino and performed there regularly back in the sixties) had been
forced to 
>sign such an agreement (laughs all around).
>
>But then we pointed out that we knew of no such arrangement and it was
not 
>for us to do anything about this because we were booked by a company
which 
>had paid for the casino/hotel facilities - banquet room, rooms for the 
>company employees (which we figured we were at that particular point)
etc. 
>and we told the young lady that she would have to take it up with the 
>company management.
>
>The company straightened the hotel out in the space of about 2 minutes
and 
>we went on and played without further incident. BUT ---
>
>Bob and I both indicated that this was the FIRST time in 45 years of 
>entertaining in venues all over the world that we had ever encounted
such an 
>egregious attempt to evade responsibility for whatever wrongdoings the
venue 
>might inflict on musicians (or, I guess, anyone in a similar position).
>
>Any others out there (besides Steve and our little trio) have similar 
>experiences to relate?
>
>How valid would such a document be if the venue could afterward be
shown to 
>be totally responsible for somebody's injuries?
>
>I'd like to find out more about the legal rights of institutions and
people 
>which such contracts in existance.
>
>Respectfully submitted,
>
>Bill "Hey, I ain't gonna sign that sonavabitch!" Gunter
>jazzboard@hotmail.com
>
>
>
>
>
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