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<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Hello, all--</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">I don't chime in often, but i very much enjoy reading the variety of posts here, from all over the world! Very informative, and educational!</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Regarding "diminished chords" <i>per se</i>, I don't see how either Bunk or George Lewis could have been "opposed" to them, or their use. I suspect the passage about them to which Mr. Gates alludes must have been taken
out of context when he saw it or heard about it. <br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Anyway, the famous--even iconic--introduction to
<b><i>Dippermouth Blues</i></b>--recorded first by <b>King Oliver's Creole Jazz Band</b> (and later by his<b> Dixie Syncopators
</b>as <i></i><b><i>Sugar Foot Stomp)</i></b> is two full bars of a diminished chord. I also recall
<i></i><b><i>Climax Rag </i></b>employs a diminished arpeggio in its first strain.</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Now that I'm really thinking about it, I recall that one of my all-time favorite recordings,
<i></i><b><i>Tip Easy Blues</i></b> by the <b>Jones-Collins Astoria Hot Eight</b>--contains yet another diminished arpeggio, played by trumpeter Lee Collins at the end of his beautiful solo.</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">So, it would seem that diminished chords abound in traditional jazz! (What will they think of next?)</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Keep Calm, and Keep Swinging,</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style="margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">--Dan Barrett.<br>
</p>
<br>
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<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 2, 2018 9:00 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Dan Barrett<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Dixielandjazz Digest, Vol 182, Issue 2</font>
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Today's Topics:<br>
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1. Re: Diminished chord question (Louis Lince)<br>
2. Re: Diminished chord question (Bert)<br>
3. Re: Diminished chord question (Aaron)<br>
4. Batchelors (Marek Boym)<br>
5. Diminished chords of "Squeeze Me" (Ken Gates)<br>
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Message: 1<br>
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2018 17:14:00 -0000<br>
From: "Louis Lince" <louis.lince@pobroadband.co.uk><br>
To: "Ken Gates" <kwg915@gmail.com><br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
Message-ID: <83934F9A33994FC7BAF5EE7BB0226D54@AdventUserPC><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Hi Ken,<br>
<br>
The second theme of "Blame it on the Blues" is based on a diminished run<br>
<br>
best<br>
<br>
Louis<br>
----- Original Message ----- <br>
From: Ken Gates <br>
To: louis.lince@pobroadband.co.uk <br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <br>
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2018 4:03 PM<br>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
<br>
<br>
Does anyone have an example of a jazz tune constructed upon a series of diminished 7 chords?<br>
<br>
<br>
Did the very early jazz musicians use diminished 7 chords in their play?<br>
<br>
<br>
I do remember reading that Bunk Johnson and George Lewis had difference of opinion<br>
about diminished chords. Bunk for, George opposed.<br>
<br>
<br>
Ken Gates<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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Message: 2<br>
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2018 17:30:10 +0000<br>
From: Bert <mister_bertje@hotmail.com><br>
To: "dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com" <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<AM5PR0902MB2196C9770032D92B35F9E7EC8AFA0@AM5PR0902MB2196.eurprd09.prod.outlook.com><br>
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<br>
<br>
Hello Ken,<br>
<br>
China Boy , copyrighted in 1922 has plain use of the diminished chord.<br>
A series of diminished chords, you will find in Airmail Special, the bridge. Of course that is not very early jazz, but it is a wellknown example.<br>
<br>
Kind regards,<br>
<br>
Bert<br>
<br>
<br>
________________________________<br>
From: Ken Gates <kwg915@gmail.com><br>
Sent: Thursday, February 1, 2018 4:03 PM<br>
To: Bert Brandsma<br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List<br>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
<br>
Does anyone have an example of a jazz tune constructed upon a series of diminished 7 chords?<br>
<br>
Did the very early jazz musicians use diminished 7 chords in their play?<br>
<br>
I do remember reading that Bunk Johnson and George Lewis had difference of opinion<br>
about diminished chords. Bunk for, George opposed.<br>
<br>
Ken Gates<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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Message: 3<br>
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2018 15:15:13 -0500<br>
From: Aaron <go4baroquemusic@aol.com><br>
To: dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com<br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
Message-ID: <161530246e3-1d4f-3d7e@webjas-vab055.srv.aolmail.net><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
<br>
Can't answer the original question about very early jazz musicians, but I love dim7 chords so I'll take a moment to talk about them. ;-)<br>
<br>
Very common in 1920s and 30s music -- I'd say more so in tunes borrowed from Tin Pan Alley and show/popular music than original jazz tunes.<br>
<br>
Usage is most often chromatic movement, often toward or away from a dom7 chord. A dim7 chord is identical to the dom7 chord a half step lower, except for the root. For instance, the upper 3 notes of a cdim7 chord are the same as a C#7 chord.<br>
<br>
It also accommodates chromatic movement of the melody or "blue notes" when the melody sits on the 3rd or 5th of a chord.<br>
<br>
An interesting side note: 4-stringed instruments (tenor/plec banjo, uke, mando, etc.), typically play dim7 chords in place of b9 (dominant flat nine) chords, but a 3rd up. The reason why: for most fretted strings, you usually modify a dom7 chord to create upper
extensions. Easiest way for a b9 or 9 chord is to move the root up because that's much easier in most cases (shape-wise) than throwing away the 5th.<br>
<br>
So for b9, you shift the root up a 1/2 step. So if you extend a C7 to a C7b9, that changes the C7
<br>
From: C E G Bb<br>
To: Db E G Bb (inverted, E G Bb Db)<br>
<br>
Or in other words, your C7 becomes an Edim7 chord. On a piano, it's inverted -- but on a 4-string fretted instrument, you can't worry much about inversions since you're constrained by string order.<br>
<br>
<br>
Aaron Minnick<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Louis Lince <louis.lince@pobroadband.co.uk><br>
To: Aaron Minnick <go4baroquemusic@aol.com><br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Sent: Thu, Feb 1, 2018 1:35 pm<br>
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
<br>
<br>
?<br>
Hi Ken,<br>
<br>
The second theme of "Blame it on the Blues" is based on a diminished run<br>
<br>
best<br>
<br>
Louis<br>
<br>
----- Original Message ----- <br>
<br>
From: Ken Gates <br>
<br>
To: louis.lince@pobroadband.co.uk <br>
<br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <br>
<br>
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2018 4:03 PM<br>
<br>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chord question<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Does anyone have an example of a jazz tune constructed upon a series of diminished 7 chords?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Did the very early jazz musicians use diminished 7 chords in their play?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I do remember reading that Bunk Johnson and George Lewis had difference of opinion<br>
<br>
about diminished chords. Bunk for, George opposed.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Ken Gates<br>
<br>
<br>
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Message: 4<br>
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2018 16:13:39 +0200<br>
From: Marek Boym <marekboym@gmail.com><br>
To: Dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com<br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Batchelors<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CABGvO8Brp9bVOtwwOiADwvTkVnn-75ikOGZwjL-0cbqT7B2bzA@mail.gmail.com><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
No, not a typo - a band name: The Batchelors of Jazz. I wonder how many<br>
listmates remember it. At least one should, as he was the bands regular<br>
drummer back in 1984, when I saw it at the Edinburgh Jazz Festival.<br>
Cheers!<br>
<br>
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<br>
Message: 5<br>
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2018 08:33:52 -0800<br>
From: Ken Gates <kwg915@gmail.com><br>
To: DJML <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com>, Bob Ringwald<br>
<rsr@ringwald.com><br>
Cc: Dixieland Jazz Mailing List <dixielandjazz@ml.islandnet.com><br>
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Diminished chords of "Squeeze Me"<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CAF-cBBK-Z5O-ncA=_yAL_eSK=y47suqESKj8Uwuk8gfrWiyufg@mail.gmail.com><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Bob Ringwald told us to---------<br>
<br>
Listen to the 13th and 14th measure of "Squeeze Me." It is a descending<br>
series of diminished chords.<br>
------------------------------------------------------------<br>
---------------------------------------------------<br>
Thanks to Bob Ringwald. Looking at my copy of chords in the American Music<br>
Caravan compact book<br>
of chords, they show those two measures as ten consecutive dim7 chords<br>
starting with Bdim7 going<br>
down to Ddim7. Then the two ending measures (15th and 16th) of the 16 bar<br>
chorus in the key of F<br>
are a conventional G7/// C7/F/.<br>
<br>
Wow----ten consecutive dim7 chords!!!!!!<br>
<br>
Ken Gates<br>
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End of Dixielandjazz Digest, Vol 182, Issue 2<br>
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