[Dixielandjazz] Credibility

Fri Feb 15 10:13:56 PST 2008

I think I made that distinction too between the musical fraternity and the 
general public.

The general public really gets off on this stuff.  Why do they hire one band 
over another?  A lot of times is has to do with the leaders resume.  One of 
my better Christmas gigs was nailed down because I played with one of the 
local bands that the customer thought was really fantastic.  That band was 
listed on my web site.  The exact quote was "if he plays with the Gary 
Dammer Band he must be pretty good".  When I came on the job with Gary as a 
side man I thought she would go into cardiac arrest she got so excited.  I 
made her day.  People really like to hire people who have been somewhere and 
done things.   I even paid him extra on the gig for his name recognition. 
People who are in the know around here know his band as a top jazz group. 
Who am I to tell them different?

There is a band in town that really sucks but to look at their web site you 
would believe that this was the best band anywhere.  So what.  These guys 
want to make a buck too.  It's enough for me to know that they suck and I 
just keep my mouth shut.  They have their fans and if I open my mouth it 
will just end up making me look bad.  Besides I really agree that they are 
keeping big band music alive and active here.

Actually I think it's an obligation of a band leader to make his group as 
attractive to the general public as possible.  The better he promotes his 
band the more he gets to exhibit his art.  I don't condone outright lying 
but in legal terms it's called puffing and that's perfectly OK and I would 
suggest expected.  Your clients will in turn advertise you and puff some 
too.

As Elizar pointed out sometimes the client will go overboard a little but 
there was no lie.  He is in fact the principal banjoist with the Jerusalem 
Symphony even though that might boggle the mind of a classic oriented 
person.
Larry
St.L
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert S. Ringwald" <robert at ringwald.com>
To: "Larry Walton" <larrys.bands at charter.net>
Cc: "Dixieland Jazz Mailing List" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 11:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Credibility

> >> "Larry Walton Entertainment - St. Louis" wrote (polite snip)
>>>
>>>
>>> On the other hand your resume is worth dollars and cents when it  comes 
>>> to
>>> advertising and the general public.  Personally I use everything I  have 
>>> to
>>> sell myself.
> (snip)
>
>
> Steve Barbone answered:
>
>> That pretty much nails it shut Larry. One of the big problems with 
>> perception in life is relatively simple to overcome. IMO, if you do  not 
>> define yourself, others, most of whom who do not know what you are 
>> about, will define you in their terms. As a result, you get defined 
>> wrongly. Happens all the time in music, in politics, you name it.  Bottom 
>> line, list all of you accomplishments, don't be shy about with  whom 
>> you've played etc., etc., etc. Especially on your advertising,  your web 
>> site, what ever goes to people who do not know you.
>>
> (snip)
>
>
> IMO- Both Larry and Steve are completely right here.  They are talking 
> about advertizing and promoting yourself to the general public and/or 
> clients.
>
> However, let me say again, the original post by Jim Kash that started this 
> thread was not talking about advertizing.  As I understand it, and Jim can 
> certainly correct me if I am wrong, he was talking about promoting ones 
> self to friends, fellow musicians such as possibly other DJML members.
>
> For instance, trying to impress ones felow musicians with the names you 
> have sat in with doesn't make it.  There is an old expression,
>
> "You can't shit an old shitter."
>
>
> Steve continues:
>
>  >  Best example IMO is trombonist Herb Gardner's web site list of
>> people whom who he has worked as a featured jazz soloist: Now this may 
>> be name dropping to some, so be it.
> (snip)
>
>
> Again, IMO- This is not name droppping.  First of all it is advertizing. 
> Secondly, it is obvious that a musician of his caliber has played with and 
> been featured with the names he has on his list.  This is believeable...
>
> I for instance, when speaking with a client who knows who Bobby Hackett 
> is, might mention that I played with him.  If I am hussling a gig, I might 
> neglect to tell him that it was a jam session type situation.  I was not 
> hired by Bobby, or anyone else to play with him.
>
> I think what Jim was trying to say was that possibly stretching the truth 
> to a client is one thing, but bragging to your piers (who know better) is 
> something else.
>
> Jim, please correct me if I am wrong.
>
> --Bob Ringwald
>
>
>
>
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