[Dixielandjazz] Rebuking Larry

Sun May 27 21:41:41 PDT 2007

I wouldn't know why it would have done that - I have no filters or 
blockers - but you don't have to go off list - I can handle it.

I wasn't really intending to blanket all female (male too) singers.  There 
are those who are professional and who make a good living and give an honest 
return for the customers and band leaders money but at the same time for 
each one of those there are many more who just aren't.  They tend to not 
last long in the business for a long list of reasons.  I was in a band one 
time where the singer was a druggie and her husband owned the band.  Both 
were very talented but I bailed out and took the keyboard player and drummer 
with me.

It's really a simple formula and it's the same if you play some instrument 
or sing.  Be professional, do what you say you are going to do, be where you 
are supposed to be, don't beg out of jobs, learn the tunes, don't waste the 
band's time and be good at what you do.  I find it really hard to see how 
you or anyone else can argue with that and I also find it hard to imagine 
that you haven't been around singers that regularly break one or more of 
those rules on a regular basis.  They do things to band leaders that they 
would never dream of doing on a regular job.

The problem with a pregnant woman is not the leader's perception or the 
woman's talent or her work ethic either but rather the public's reaction to 
her on stage and what they do.  If they decide to not hire you for whatever 
reason you don't work.  You can't influence the public or their decision 
making or make them choose you over someone else as much as we would like 
to.  I am only saying it makes a difference.

The people I am talking about are the working bands.  I am not talking about 
hobby bands, the once a month guys or community bands and I guess I'm not 
talking about the people at the top or what any of them do. The economics of 
those bands are pretty much immune from ordinary reality and they can get 
away with a lot more.  Having said that I don't think I have ever seen a 
pregnant vocalist in front of any of them either. (Maybe Cher)

I still use a female vocalist because it sells well and gives the band 
variety that people like.  That's completely aside from vocalists who are 
playing at being professional singers and I think there is a vast 
distinction.

Band leaders invest a lot of energy, time and money in singers and some are 
just very high maintenance.  Most bands just don't want the baggage or to 
fool with it.  One of the hobby bands here who has been in existence for a 
great many years just bounced their singer / trombone player because she 
just got on too many peoples toes.   She was a pretty good singer and people 
generally liked her.  She was with them about 10 years.  Her bank president 
husband quit too.  Even hobby bands have their limits.

A previous singer with my band was a personal friend but the price in 
baggage just got too high to pay and I replaced her.  Some of that baggage 
wasn't even her fault.   I regret that because she's better than great but 
there is a limit to how much I will allow a singer or a situation to jerk me 
around.   All of the other things come first then talent - It's not the 
other way around.

I notice that no one out there has refuted anything I have said, nor have 
you except to say you don't like what I said.  I wish it weren't that way 
but my experience has been that since I actually employed a pregnant woman 
to front a band I found it wasn't a very good idea.  For heaven's sake it 
cost her money too.  I didn't fire her and she rode through the loss of gigs 
the same as we did.  She eventually left town with her husband or I would 
still be using her.  I liked her that well.

OH NO there's another reason - leaving town with your husband that just got 
fired from his job.  Women have a whole lot more pressures to not work or be 
professional than they have incentive to be professional and continue 
working.  The singer I have now is trying very hard but she has a family 
that, as it should, comes first.  I work with her and understand these 
things but there are limits and she knows that.

How many pregnant singers have you seen? dozens, several, one or none.  Were 
they fronting a working band that played regular or a hobby band?  Has any 
working band out there ever had a pregnant singer for an extended length of 
time?  What happened?  I only told you what happened in our case.

I have been in the business for a very long time and I have to say I have 
never seen a pregnant singer fronting a band either in casual work or clubs 
around here.  That's not to say that it has never happened just that no one 
that I know of has ever done it except myself and it turned out IMO to be a 
poor idea.

I am in the music business and I make decisions regarding that business so 
it can stay in business.  As such it's there to make money for myself as 
well as for the other band members.  It's not there to be a social 
experiment or to make anyone feel good.
Larry

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Judy Eames" <jude at judyeames.co.uk>
To: "Larry Walton" <larrys.bands at charter.net>
Cc: "Dixieland Jazz Mailing List" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2007 2:26 PM
Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Rebuking Larry

> My rebuke bounced back
>
> Larry I tried to reply (nicely :-) ) to a couple of your personal posts 
> and they bounced back too.  I wanted to tell you off list why I found your 
> blanket villification of female singers a bit out of order but it's not to 
> be :-)
>
> Jude
>
>
> Judy Eames
> Kaminsky Connection
> Aston, Oxfordshire
> UK
> www.judyeames.co.uk
>
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