[Dixielandjazz] Oh Dem Bones

[Marek Boym]

Have you ever heard Sir (the title is real) Roy Williams?  You should.
 Fenomenal technique and swing.
Some (long)  time ago, Audiophile (one of the GHB labels) issued a
wonderful trombone LP - Five A Slide, featuring Williams, Pete
Strange, Jim Shepherd, John Beecham and Campbell Burnap in a trombone
quintet - great listening (it was not in the GHB 2005 catalogue, but
might have since been resissued).  Anothe rendition of the group was
issued in the UK, with, I believe, Roy Crimmins.  If you like the
trombone, well worth the effort of search!
And do not forget another giant of the trombone - George Chisholm (British).
In 1935, the (British) Lew Davis Trombone Trio made some very nice recordings.
And one should not overlook the excellent "Jazz Trombones" (if I'm not
mistaken - Eddie Metz Jr.'s first record), featuring Bill allred and
Al Winters, issued in the mid-70's of the last century on the Jim
Taylor Presents label (JTP 1).
And no, I'm not a trombone player, and my favourite instrument is the clarinet.
Cheers,
Marek

On 08/03/07, LRG4003 at aol.com <LRG4003 at aol.com> wrote:
>
> WARNING.  A LONG POST WITH A LOT OF  OPINIONS ABOUT TROMBONISTS..  DELETE NOW
> OR DON'T BLAME ME  LATER....
>
> Yesterday, i passed along some Trombone  comments from a trombone playing
> non-list member and saw a number of interesting  responses on DJML which I passed
> back to him.  I am, again sending you more  of his thoughts (since I can't
> get him to suck up and join DJM himself).  I  think he has some interesting
> things to say and would like to hear from any of  you who have the same passion
> for the instrument and the people who play  it.   (Obviously his tenor sax
> comment is completely out of  line).     K. C.  Clarinet
>
>
>
> First of all, there are two completely  different issues that need to be
> explicitly separated.  The first issue is  the one I addressed (and will comment
> on again below) and has to do with what  standards should be held up as the
> very best in jazz trombone playing and the  realization that such standards are
> attainable, even if they are not actually  attained by all professional jazz
> trombonists.  The second issue is  the enjoyment factor of any and all that love
> playing the trombone.  You  don't have to be a Christian Lindberg to get
> enjoyment from playing, thank  heavens!!!  These two issues should NEVER be
> confused or mixed.
>
> As far as the whole jazz trombone standard  of excellence issue goes, it
> really boils down to the definition people use  as to what really great playing
> is.  I have heard of most of the players  mentioned below in the notes that you
> forwarded to me, and some of them are part  of what I previously referred to
> as the "some players that most people have not  heard of". For instance, I have
> some of Andy Martin's recordings, and his is a  fine player with a mature
> technique and solid improvising ability.
>
> There are some others also.  I  mentioned Herb Bruce.  I noticed that no one
> else mentioned him.  They  should have!  Herb can hold court with the best of
> them.  Every  trombonist should have copies of his last two CD's  "Herbicide"
> and "Heaven  and Earth".  For goodness sake, go to _www.herbbruce.com_
> (http://www.herbbruce.com/)  and buy them!  (No,  I do not get a cut!)  There are
> other unknown great players.  One  fellow who lives in a small town in Arkansas
> and has cut at least one CD of jazz  versions of Christian hymns (I have it) is
> also a monster, but I would bet money  that the total number of people in
> this country that have heard of him would not  even populate a typical small U.S.
> town.  And yes, Ron Wilkins is a good  player too.
>
> So, you see, I have heard of these  players.  Also, back in the mid to late
> 1990's a wonderful trombone group  "Spiritual To The Bone" cut about five CD's
> that are just great.  Herb  Bruce was one of the featured soloists on these
> CD's.  So, yes there are  some great players out there, and some of them are
> great jazz players as  well.  But, what I was referring to in my earlier note was
> great JAZZ  players as opposed to great studio players (not always the same
> thing by  any stretch of the imagination).  There are some fantastic  studio
> trombonists in the L.A. area who have banded together over the last  40 years in
> an informal organization called "Bohanan's Garage"  (The reason  for that
> name takes too long to explain).  Some of the members of  that organization have
> put together a great CD called "All My  Concertos".  This is a large trombone
> ensemble that recorded all the  written compositions of the late studio
> trombonist/composer Tommy  Pederson.  While this is excellent playing and wonderful
> compositions,  it is for the most part not jazz in the truest sense of the
> word.  This is  not a devaluation of the work by any means, simply a statement
> that not all  great playing is jazz.
>
> The Tommy Pederson works are a very  interesting and VERY musically
> satisfying blend of what I would call jazz  and neo-impressionist/romantic classical
> music.  The trombonists  playing in this CD are excellent players who have
> developed a very high level of  competency on their instrument. (For the person who
> mentioned Alan Kaplan,  he is one of these trombonists. Alan also has a
> relatively new solo CD out  that is mostly ballad stuff and very well played.)
> And there are  players like that in all the really big U.S. cities.  However,
> most of  these people are not great jazz players of the category of an 'in their
> prime"  Rosolino or Fontana.  And that is what I meant in my earlier  note.
> If you really want to know what the trombone is capable of these  days, please
> listen to recordings of Joseph Alessi (principal with NY Phil),  Ian
> Bousfield (principal with Vienna Phil), Nick Hudson (a true poet of the  trombone and
> principal with William Fairey Brass Band in England), and of course  Christian
> Lindberg (with more than 50 CD's to his name now!).  The point of  my first
> soap box was that the standard for technical excellence in  jazz MUST keep up
> with what exists in the classical world.   Again, I am not saying that the
> LEVEL of jazz trombone playing must for all  players keep up with the highest
> level of playing in the classical world, only  that the STANDARD needs to keep up.
>
>
> Frankly, I am tired of people explicitly or  (what is more common) implicitly
> trying to either dumb down  the technical standard of jazz trombone playing
> or justifying  its lower standard (relative to today's classical playing).   I
> guess my standards for jazz playing are annoyingly high.  They certainly  have
> gone up over the last 30 years.  For instance, I first heard  Watrous on a
> late 1960's promotional LP called "The Straight Life"   (pretty ironic title for
> Bill during that period of time!).  He  also did an almost unknown solo
> ballad LP called "William Russell Watrous" that  had nothing but sweet ballads
> backed by strings.  Watrous was an  unknown quantity back then, and did not really
> become well known until the  mid 70's with his Manhattan Wildlife Refuge
> recordings.  I admit that I was  blown over by his playing on his Straight Life LP
> and even more so in the  mid 70's with his Refuge recordings and his set of
> small ensemble LP's that  followed that.  Today, I still listen to Watrous, and
> I still buy his  recordings when they come out.  However, I am not completely
>  blown over by his playing any more.  After listening to today's  top
> symphonic players, I have raised my standards for jazz playing.  My  standard for
> jazz players is that they have a full, harmonics-rich,  well-centered tone that
> does not thin out even a little when going up to high  F's!  It can be done.
> (I really cannot stand hearing the term  "velvety tone" which is just a nice
> way of saying the tone is not full and rich,  especially when you get above high
> C.)  Listen to Alessi's recording of a  Carmen Suite on his "Trombonastics"
> CD to understand what upper register  trombone tone should sound like.  And
> please do not give me that tired old  saw about there being different tones for
> trombone.  Rubbish!  The  same tone that makes for a top classical trombonist
> should be the tone for  a jazz trombonist.  There can be minor tonal shadings
> used for both  classical and jazz trombone playing, depending on what you are
> doing.   However, the same basic tone should be accomplished.   My  standard
> for jazz players includes fast technical playing that is up  to the level of a
> Christian Lindberg when playing the Winter Concerto from  Vivaldi's Fours
> Seasons.  (Yes, I know that he recorded that on alto  trombone, but we are talking
> fast technique now!)  My standard for  jazz trombone playing now includes lip
> flexibility that allows for perfectly  controlled and clean lip trilling (not
> shakes!!!) at the same level as those  classical players that I listed.  And
> by the way, Jack Teagarden proved  that this was do-able in his 1944 beautiful
> solo version of Sophisticated  Lady.  (After all, the standard of lip
> flexibility in jazz set by Jack more  than 60 years ago still stands, or at least it
> should.)  Don't  misunderstand me.  I do not want jazz transmutated into a
> classical wannabe style.  (Ugh, that would be worse than all  those horrible
> recordings by opera divas singing pop ballads!)  I just want  the same standard of
> playing in jazz to be commonly held up that now  exists in the classical
> arena.  There are some that are doing it, but  not as many as some might imagine
> if they would take the time to really,  really listen to the great classical
> players.  For instance, how  many jazz trombone enthusiasts today have actually
> heard Ian  Bousfield's CD "The Versatile Virtuoso"?  It should be required
> listening  for ANYONE who wants to claim to be knowledgeable in trombone playing,
> whether  jazz, classical, or otherwise.  Bousfield's recording of "Rhapsody
> For  Trombone and Brass Band" is one of the finest and emotionally satisfying
> trombone recordings of any genre that I have ever heard.  (It also is a
> heavily jazz-tinged piece with an extended improvised section.)  Now, to  another
> issue raised by someone.  Is it necessary for all professional (or
> non-professional) jazz trombonists to play with this level of technical  accomplishment?
> OF COURSE NOT!!!   To even insinuate that is  just plain stupid.  However,
> this IS the level of accomplishment that  should unswervingly be held up as the
> standard by which trombone playing should  be measured.  And I do not think
> that is being done in the jazz trombone  community today, at least to the extent
> that it should be.  If a jazz  trombonist does not play at the highest level
> of performance possible, should  people no longer enjoy his playing?  Of
> course not.  As I mentioned, I  still listen to Watrous (and many, many others) and
> I still enjoy his playing  even if I am no longer knocked over with scorched
> eyebrows.  But we need to  always hold up the very highest standards as the
> target for everyone to shoot  at.  And if we do not know what that target is,
> how can we hold it  up?  How many jazz trombone enthusiasts actually buy and
> listen to  recordings by the really great non-jazz trombonists that I mentioned
> earlier in  this note? (And those names I gave were only a partial list.  I did
> not  mention Ronald Barron, Ralph Sauer, Jay Freidman, etc, etc.)  Certainly
> some do, but my experience tells me that it is not a large percentage.  The
> condensation of what I am saying is simple:  I am absolutely convinced that
> one of the reasons that the trombone is becoming less and less used in jazz
> groups as anything other than back up sound, is the continued idiotic notion
> that the trombone is a clumsy instrument that cannot do what tenor saxes can
> do.  There is absolutely no reason for that notion, and all those who  continue
> to think that way should be strapped to a chair and required to  listen to all
> 50+ of Christian Lindberg's CDs, going back to his first one  cut in about
> 1982!  And if they still don't get the message, then move on  to the CD's of
> other great trombonists.  And if they start to cry and beg  you to stop force
> feeding them classical trombone music, then put on Herb  Bruce's "Heaven and
> Earth" CD and play his cut of the Tommy Dorsey masterpiece  "Trombonology".  Does
> it sound like I am sick and tired of hearing  one shrill, honking tenor sax
> solo after another?  Yes I  am.
>
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