[Dixielandjazz] Panama Rag (was Chrysanthemum Ragtime Band)

[Bill Haesler]

>  I can't help with this one.
>  Bill, Would you know if it was Panama (William H Tyers, 1912) or 
> Panama Rag
>  (Charles Seymour, 1904) that is on the LP?

Dear Phil,
According to my Stomp Off Records file it was the earlier (1904) Cy 
Seymour version of "Panama Rag" played on the Chrysanthemum Ragtime 
Band LP.
As you indicate, the original and correct name for the William H Tyers 
composition is simply "Panama".
Notwithstanding that many record listings (and musicians) often add 
"Rag" to it.
"Panama" was apparently named for the vaudeville team Aida Overton 
Walker and Her Panama Girls, a title probably originating with the 
country.
Now you've set me off again!
While looking for a version of "Panama Rag" in my collection I started 
wondering who was the first to add the word 'Rag" to the Tyers' 
composition.
Based on the chronological recording dates, it would appear to have 
been Kid Ory in 1944 as this is the first version of the Tyers "Panama" 
I can find with the Rag suffix.
I have a Saydisc 'Pianola Ragtime' LP with the 1904 "Panama Rag" but am 
still looking for other versions (if any) in my collection.
Here are some 'Panama/Panama Rag' items of interest:
1.  From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
"Panama (jazz standard).
  Panama (sometimes incorrectly called Panama Rag) is a jazz standard. 
It is by William H. Tyers, originally entitled "Panama, a 
Characteristic Novelty", published in 1912.
   As expected of a jazz standard, it has been played and recorded by a 
number of jazz legends including the New Orleans Rhythm Kings, Sharkey 
Bonano, Kid Ory, the Eureka Brass Band, Humphrey Lyttelton and many 
others.
   The famous trumpet variation commonly played by New Orleans, 
Louisiana bands and those influenced by the New Orleans style, was 
reportedly devised by Manuel Manetta who first taught it to his start 
trumpet pupils Emmett Hardy and Red Allen.
   The original tango or maxie rhythm is usually disgarded in favor of 
4/4 time, but can still be detected in some versions, such as the early 
recording by Johnny DeDroit's Band.
   Some later genenerations have sometimes confused it with a totally 
different piece of a similar name, a ragtime number composed by Charles 
Seymour (composer) in 1904 called Panama Rag. This lesser known number 
has been recorded by the New Orleans Ragtime Orchestra and was 
reportedly played by Buddy Bolden when the tune was new, but is rather 
obscure and far from a standard."
2.  From a sheet music collection site:
Panama	Tyers, William H.	1911	 	
Panama Rag	Seymour, Cy	1904  arranged by Dahlman, H.A.
3.  I then came across an odd reference in Brian Rust's 'Jazz Records' 
discography to a Vess L Ossman banjo solo recorded for Victor on 5 Feb 
1907 which Rust lists as 'Panama Rag (Will H Towers)'. This is four 
years too early for the Tyers' composition. I suspect that Brian was 
guessing, as in all editions (except the latest) he also lists it as 
unissued. Therefore I think we can still blame Kid Ory.
4.  While looking for a biography of Cy (or Charles) Seymour I came up 
with the following:
"Virtually nothing is known about Cy Seymour other than those facts 
which can be gleaned from the covers of original sheet music. Some even 
suppose that the name is in fact itself a pseudonym. He published a 
handful of rags, all excellent, and is best known for his highly 
praised and much recorded Panama Rag. List of Cy Seymour's works. The 
Black Laugh (1904) Panama Rag (1904), Holy Moses (1906), Clover Leaf 
Rag (1909)."
[Phil. BTW where did you find the reference to 'Charles' Seymour?]
Other searches for 'Seymour' led to the famous "St Louis Tickle" which 
has a musical connection with Jelly Roll Morton and "Buddy Bolden's 
Blues'. [But that's another story.]
Then I found: "Saturday morning the symposia resumed with historian 
Murray Bishoff profiling the life of “Theron Bennett, Missouri 
Composer.” Bennett traveled widely as a representative of the publisher 
Victor Kremer absorbing the unique regional styles that then existed in 
the days before homogenization. Consensus is that he wrote the popular 
St. Louis Tickle attributed to Barney and Seymour."
Other references to the 'Seymour' of Barney and Seymour spell it 
Seymore.

There has been a lot of new research work carried out regarding the 
history of Ragtime in recent years, so the Cy Seymour mystery may have 
been solved.
All we need now is for OKOM musicians to omit the word Rag when 
referring to the c.1911 Will Tyers' tune.
Regards,
Bill.