[Dixielandjazz] Preservation ? Creativity? Rule # 1

[Steve barbone]

Larry Walton larrys.bands at charter.net wrote: (polite snip)

> When someone starts playing
> free form for example in the middle of a Trad tune it's inappropriate but by
> the same token it might be a kick ass solo in that form.

Maybe so, but I'd have to hear it in order to judge it. I havew played with
a lot of piano players, for example, who are strictly modern jazz players,
but they still mesh within the Dixieland Style even if playing huge chord
extensions.

> Don't bother me with all this free love stuff.  If you didn't play within
> the rules you simply wouldn't have been in music this long.

Not advocating free love or free form jazz. But, our band breaks the "trad"
rules all the time concerning tempo, chordal extensions, and even choice of
songs and rhythmic pulse.

> Experimentation 
> and Jazz go hand in hand and I'm sure that the first solos did sound
> presumptuous.  People liked what they heard so it caught on.

Yes, because it was popular danceable music. Now most trad is not played for
dancers (young dancers) it is no longer in favor.
> 
> Creating a new form is different than mindlessly breaking rules because you
> think it's cute.  A good example of someone breaking the rules and creating
> new forms which by the way sadly didn't catch on was Dave Brubeck.  His
> "Take 5" and the other tunes on that album were groundbreaking and also rule
> breaking. 

No serious jazz musician breaks rules because he/she thinks it's cute.
Brubeck is one of my heroes. He was immensely popular when I was young. He
broke all sorts of new ground including popularizing his music on the
college circuit by marketing to them himself, with lots of help from his
wife's direct mail. It was only after he self generated a dozen of so
college gigs that Joe Glaser sought him out and became his agent. His
experiments with time are still very much in play among jazz musicians. And
many of us Dixieland musicians go from one time signature to another
frequently. It is well to recall that Dave Brubeck was the first jazz
musician to make the cover of "TIME" magazine, much to his chagrin as he
felt that honor should have gone to Ellington.
> 
> You follow rules such as more or less uniform tempos,  standard keys, forms
> such as AABA,   Now break those three in a string of tunes and you won't
> have an audience except for the drunk at the end of the bar who doesn't know
> you are just trying out the latest key from Afghanistan and are in 5 and you
> aren't using a form.  So don't make me tired with all this I don't follow
> rules stuff.

Not sure those are really "rules". We sometimes play the tempo that the tune
was written to, and sometimes not. We sometimes play the key it was written
in and sometimes not. And yes, if the song was written AABA, we normally
play AABA. We often modulate, especially in tunes begun in C, to Db (5),
because it lifts the out chorus. Or in Mack The Knife where we go up a half
step, chorus by chorus. By ignoring "rules" I am not advocating free jazz,
unless the band is a avant garde. Then, by all means do your thing.
 
> Having said that I will repeat - a musician can stay within a style and
> create music that everyone will enjoy that is different each time.  The
> Bobcat illustration is a good one I think.

Yes, I agree they are a solid trad band. But, they also use some extended
chords when the spirit moves them. They do, however, stay within the style
in the broad sense, as do most of us. I was not advocating leaving the
style, just not being afraid to modernize it. That's what Bix and later
Condon did. As well as what Mole, Teagarden, Pee Wee Russell et al did. And
what Kenny Davern, Randy Reinhart, Ed Metz and a bunch of others do now
which is why I now listen more to them than to my dead guy heroes.
 
> At least you and I agree that we shouldn't copy someone else.  How boring it
> would be if every Artist painted the same picture over and over even if the
> original artist is yourself.

We also agree about staying with the style (at least in a broad sense) It is
also well to note that, Louis copied his same solos time after time with the
All Stars. He was still the most exciting Dixieland trumpet player I ever
saw. I guess there are exceptions to every rule, even ours. :-) VBG.

Cheers,
Steve Barbone