[Dixielandjazz] Racist lyrics, Limehouse Blues (was Aunt Hagar's Blues)

Mon Jul 24 09:41:52 PDT 2006

Hi Rae Ann and all,

You wrote (re: Limehouse Blues): "To me Limehouse Blues has a line that says 
'Say it with a beautiful song' from Say It With Music.  Anybody else agree?"

I can't find those words anywhere in any of the versions of the song I've 
seen, but I don't particularly disagree because it's possible somebody on 
some recording may have added that line.  However, the only response to it 
when I google it is in "Say it with music."

Say it with music - Beautiful music
Somehow they'd rather be kissed
To the strains of Chopin or Liszt
Melodies mellow - Played on a cello
Help Mr. Cupid along
So SAY IT WITH A BEAUTIFUL SONG.

That aside . . . what's interesting to me is that the following lyrics 
appear in the verse and chorus of "Limehouse Blues" (Firehouse Fakebook):

"In Limehouse, Where yellow Chinkies love to play . . . I've the real 
Limehouse blues, learned from the chinkies those sad China blues."

Oh my . . . I have never heard those lyrics sung but somebody must have 
because there they are.

And how about "Squaws Along the Yukon" (Ooga-ooga-mooska)?  I understand the 
terms "squaw" is today an unacceptable racist epithet . . . is that true?

Respectfully submitted,

Bill "Honkie" Gunter (oops, can I say that?)

jazzboard at hotmail.com

>From: rahberry at comcast.net
>To: tduncan at bellatlantic.net, "'Bill Gunter'" 
><jazzboard at hotmail.com>,<jobriant at garlic.com>, 
><dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
>CC: "Tom Duncan" <tduncan at bellatlantic.net>
>Subject: RE: [Dixielandjazz] Aunt Hagar's Blues
>Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2006 06:46:28 +0000
>
>Hi Bill and DJML,
>To me Limehouse Blues has a line that says "Say it with a beautiful song" 
>from Say It With Music.  Anybody else agree?
>--Rae Ann
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
>From: "Tom Duncan" <tduncan at bellatlantic.net>
> > To shed some light on this confusion for Bill Gunter and Jim Briant and 
>all
> > of us, redhotjazz.com has "The Hooking Cow Blues" recorded by "Handy's
> > Orchestra of Memphis" on 9-24-17 in New York for Columbia (Columbia 
>A2420 or
> > Columbia 2913). Maybe Bill from Oz can weigh in with the definitive 
>answer
> > as he so often does.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Tom Duncan
> > 201-836-6076
> > www.doctordubious.com
> > doctordubious at verizon.net 
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: dixielandjazz-bounces at ml.islandnet.com
> > [mailto:dixielandjazz-bounces at ml.islandnet.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gunter
> > Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 12:01 AM
> > To: jobriant at garlic.com; dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
> > Subject: RE: [Dixielandjazz] Aunt Hagar's Blues
> >
> > Hi Jim and all,
> >
> > You write (concerning "Aunt Hagar's Blues") that the Neighbors book and 
>the
> > Firehouse book have virtually identical versions. You also mention that 
>the
> > Anderson book provides a nearly identical version although the title in 
>the
> > Anderson book is one word longer than the others.
> >
> > Then you go on to state: "To further confuse the situation . . ."
> >
> > Now I have to admit here that I'm at a loss to figure out where the 
>actual
> > confusion lies. Let me see . . . you cite four sources (including the 
>two
> > from the Anderson book) that are all virtually the same and you find 
>this
> > "confusing"?  That really confuses me.  The fact that three difference
> > sources tend to agree on some issue would hardly qualify as "confusing."
> > I'd probably be more confused if they didn't agree.
> >
> > However, you go on to state (after the "confusion" part): "[To further
> > confuse the situation,] I recently purchased a CD of recordings made by 
>W.C.
> >
> > Handy's Memphis Blues Band between 1917 and 1923.  One of the tunes on 
>the
> > record is called the "Honking Cow Blues." It contains the
> > distinctive second strain of "Aunt Hagar's Blues."
> >
> > This shouldn't be of any great concern. It happens quite often.  For
> > example, has anyone noticed in the tune "East St. Louis Toodle-oo" that 
>one
> > of the strains sound suspiciously like "I Wish I Could Shimmy Like my 
>Sister
> >
> > Kate"? There are numerous occasions where similar sounding strains show 
>up
> > in different tunes.
> >
> > I've never heard of "Honking Cow Blues" and my attempts to Google it up 
>have
> >
> > led noplace. But it doesn't surprise me that you might find a strain 
>therein
> >
> > associated with some other tune.
> >
> > Matter of fact, that might make an interesting thread:
> >
> > "Can you think of tunes which contain distinctive strains from some 
>other
> > traditional jazz tune?"
> >
> > I already listed one ("East St. Louis Toodle-oo" and "Sister Kate") 
>above.
> >
> > Respectfully submitted,
> >
> > Bill Gunter
> > jazzboard at hotmail.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: "James O'Briant" <jobriant at garlic.com>
> > >To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> > >Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Aunt Hagar's Blues
> > >Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:01:20 -0700
> > >
> > >Here's a question for some of the archivist on this list....
> > >
> > >Two of the bands with which I sub from time to time play "Aunt Hagar's
> > >Blues." Both play it from the lead sheet that's # 295 in the Neighbors 
>Fake
> > >Book.  The Firehouse Fake Book (where it's # 387) is virtually 
>identical.
> > >
> > >The same tune (all three strains) appears twice in the Anderson 
>Collection
> > >-- once in Volume 1, Page 59, and once in Vol. I of the "With Verses"
> > >section, Page 122V.  The tune is again nearly identical, but in both 
>places
> > >Anderson gives the title as "Aunt Hagar's Children's Blues."
> > >
> > >To further confuse the situation, I recently purchased a CD of 
>recordings
> > >made by W.C. Handy's Memphis Blues Band between 1917 and 1923.  One of 
>the
> > >tones on the record is called the "Honking Cow Blues." It contains the
> > >distinctive second strain of "Aunt Hagar's Blues."
> > >
> > >Can anyone clear up the title discrepancy, and illuminate any 
>connection
> > >between "Aunt Hagar" and "Honking Cow?"
> > >
> > >Jim O'Briant
> > >Tuba
> > >Gilroy, CA
> > >
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
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> > >Dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com
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> >
> >
> >
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