[Dixielandjazz] Creation and Re-creation

[Vaxtrpts at aol.com]

In a message dated 9/20/2005 2:32:03 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
larrys.bands at charter.net writes:

I agree  with Mike but there is another dimension  when dealing with  playing
the older OKOM from the 30's back and that is style.   Recreating the sound
and style of 30's and earlier music by a modern  musician is difficult
because we swing and newer styles creep into our  solos both recreated or
jazz.  Recreating or originating early jazz  styles and solos even if they
are your own and pure jazz will often sound  corny or dated.  What happens is
guys start filling in with other  licks, more "modern" scales and the flavor
is lost.  Listen to  drummers, very few do it right.  They invariably start
to swing and  their drums and cymbals just aren't the same so the right sound
isn't  there.  If you don't mind this then I guess it's ok.  My point is  that
it is difficult to do something that you didn't grow up with and  almost none
of us were musicians during that era.

It's like learning  a language.  My son who has lived in Germany for 20 years
and speaks  the language fluently still sounds like an American because he
didn't grow  up with it. My granddaughter while fluent in English will always
sound like  a German.  Musical Style and licks are like that.

I'm not sure  very many really want to recreate the styles and sounds exactly
because  they sound dated to modern ears.
Larry
St.  Louis



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  
I don't usually copy a whole message into mine, but I wasn't sure where to  
cut this one.  Lots of good points, but I think I am completely  confused.  You 
seem to say that is impossible to re-create older jazz. So  are you saying 
that the trad bands shouldn't even try?
My observations are a little different, in that I choose not to imitate  
those early bands because I believe that jazz has to have some of one's own  
creativity to be called jazz.
Actually, have you ever heard Dick Hyman play?  He can imitate ANY  style 
perfectly.  Truly amazing.  I have also heard some bands that  play in the style 
and sound of those earlier bands very well.  It is not my  "cup of tea" for 
the reasons that I have already mentioned, but some bands do it  very well.
I do have to disagree with you on one point.  There ARE people on this  list 
who grew up hearing the music all through their lives. They may not have  been 
musicians yet, but "hearing is believing" to semi-quote the Dukes of  
Dixieland. And yes, some of them are old enough to have played the music  back in the 
30's.
I grew up listening to OKOM and big bands from the time I was a small  boy.  
The radio was a wonderful tool to learn from, as well as the records  that I 
wore out (78's) by playing them over and over and trying to copy the  style of 
the musicians I heard.  I have played on bands as diverse as: Shep  Fields, 
the Glenn Miller Orchestra, the Jimmy Dorsey Orchestra, the Ray McKinley  
Orchestra, the Stan Kenton Orchestra, Pee Wee Hunt's band, the Dukes of  Dixieland, 
the Olympia Brass Band and the Heritage Hall Jazz Band.  I  believe that I did 
a good job playing the "right style" for all those  bands.  I did it because 
I knew what they were supposed to sound  like.  Did I play my solos note for 
note off an early recording?  No -  but I certainly didn't play bebop in Pee 
Wee Hunt's band, for example.
Make any sense?
Mike Vax