[Dixielandjazz] Military bands, brass bands and jazz

[darnhard at ozemail.com.au]

Hi Anton
 I'm in agreement with you but on Holiday . Big subject. I'll comment next week
Cheers 
Dan Hardie
 PS I'm sure you have checked  out the chapter in Ancestry of Jazz others might like to follow it up 
> 
> From: Anton Crouch <anton.crouch at optusnet.com.au>
> Date: 01/07/2005 15:24:47
> To: DJML <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Military bands, brass bands and jazz
> 
> 
> Hello all
> 
> This is a BIG topic indeed and one that certainly needs a comprehensive
> study. That said, I think that there is a danger of "comprehensiveness"
> leading to a unitary view that tries to link things that may not actually
> go together.
> 
> I remember, to my embarrasment, talking to a tenor horn player in a
> colliery band and saying that I liked Sousa's music, and being given a
> frosty look with a comment something like "that's military band music -
> we're a BRASS band!" Oops.
> 
> The distinction is real in "purists" minds and reflects the fact that brass
> bands are actually a subset of military bands - if you doubt this, remember
> that brass bands use valved instruments and, hence, came into being no
> earlier than the beginning of the 19th century. While both military bands
> and brass bands were (and are) used for marching purposes I'd suggest that,
> by the end of the 19th century, a polarisation had occurred. The brass
> bands concentrated on concert-giving and virtuoso instrumental
> performances, and the military bands became the new dance bands.
> 
> So, how does jazz fit into this? With some difficulty.
> 
> Previous posts have referred to William Schafer's book "Brass bands and New
> Orleans jazz" (1977) and this clearly shows that African-American brass
> bands predate jazz by at least a generation. The big question is "when did
> the street parade and funeral bands, so often mentioned in jazz histories,
> begin to play what we would now call jazz?" The question gets even more
> complicated when we introduce blues and remember that W C Handy was a
> bandsman in Memphis as well as being "the father of the blues".
> 
> For the purposes of (?heated) discussion I offer an hypothesis   :-)
> 
> Late 19th century brass bands in New Orleans were not part of the emergence
> of jazz. Jazz developed from mixed-wind and string dance ensembles and the
> "jazzy" brass bands emerged from jazz.
> 
> If this sounds heretical, think of what we actually know about jazz in New
> Orleans in the early 20th century. In particular, think about Buddy Bolden
> and Freddie Keppard and the composition of their bands. The bands included
> violin, guitar and string bass.
> 
> I'm sure Dan Hardie will have something more to say on this.
> 
> All the best
> Anton
> 
> 
> 
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