[Dixielandjazz] Turk Murphy band horn-placement

Tue Jan 6 09:51:55 PST 2004

>the piano was in the rear
> middle.  Drums right rear & tuba left rear.

   This is a sensible arrangement.  I haven't lately, but occasionally I get
a gig with leader who is more concerned with interior decorating than how
the music sounds.
    There is a mentality that always wants the drums in the middle "because
it looks better."  Then they want the bass(me) on one side, and the piano(or
banjo, or guitar) on the other.  Of course, with the drums in the middle,
neither the bass nor the chord instrument can hear each other.
     Besides working closely with the piano, I occasionally get a young
pianist who doesn't know any tunes written before 1985, and I have to give
him the chords.  I can't do that if the drums are between us.
     No matter where you put the drummer, he will be heard by everybody, but
if you put him in the middle There will be a band on one side, and another
band on the other side.  Any interior decorators want to comment?
      Pat Cooke

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert S. Ringwald" <ringwald at calweb.com>
To: "DJML" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 12:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Turk Murphy band horn-placement


> Dan,
> >
> > I have heard stories about the placement of musicians in the Watters
band.
> > In fact, we have a guy here in Sacramento who puts his band pretty much
in
> > the configuration which you described below, with the horns in back,
> blowing
> > right over the top of the rhythm section.  .
> >
> > However, when I worked for Turk Murphy & Pete Clute, playing
intermissions
> @
> > Earthquake Magoons in SF, in the early 70's, Turk placed the piano, tuba
&
> > banjo in the back row & the horns in front.
> >
> > When I first went to work there in 1970, Smokey Stover was playing drums
&
> > there was no banjo.  In that configuration, the piano was in the rear
> > middle.  Drums right rear & tuba left rear.  Horns in front.  This is as
> you
> > are looking at the stage from the audience POV.
> >
> > The piano was turned at a 90 deg angle to the audience so that Pete's
> right
> > side was facing the audience & he was looking at the drummer over the
> piano.
> > I liked that arrangement because the drummer was right there by the
sound
> > board of the piano.  The tuba was right behind Pete's back.  With the
> front
> > off of the piano, the tuba player could also hear the piano.  Pete
played
> > pretty strong.  Thus, the rhythm section could hear each other well &
> really
> > play together.
> >
> > Bob
> > mr.wonderful at ringwald.com
> > Placerville, CA, USA, Earth, Sol's System, Milky Way
> > Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV
> > Fulton Street Jazz Band
> > See: http://www.ringwald.com
> > Boondockers Jazz & Comedy Band
> > See: http://www.theboondockers.com
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dan Augustine" <ds.augustine at mail.utexas.edu>
> > To: "DJML" <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> > Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 7:44 PM
> > Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Turk Murphy band horn-placement
> >
> >
> > > DJMLers--
> > >      In respect to the placement of the horns in Turk Murphy's band
> > > (behind the drums), he may have liked and copied the way Lu Watters
> > > did it.  In _Emperor Norton's Hunch_, John Buchanan says:
> > >
> > >          "Unlike Oliver's band, however, the Yerba Buena band made
> greater
> > >      use of the fortissimo attack."  "...the power they generated was
> > >      overwhelming.  Many experienced jazz enthusiasts were of the
> opinion
> > >      that Watters played the loudest cornet or trumpet they had ever
> heard
> > >      and perhaps the loudest of all time." (p. 74)
> > >          "The way in which Lu set the band up on the bandstand was
also
> a
> > >      little unorthodox.  In the front row the banjos were placed on
the
> > >      left, drums in the centre and the piano on the right.  In the
back
> > >      row, one step higher, from left to right we the trombone, then
the
> > >      two trumpets, the clarinet and the tuba to the right behind the
> > piano.
> > >      After trying many arrangements, Watters found that having the
> > trumpets,
> > >      clarinet and trombone standing behind the rhythm section enabled
> the
> > >      musicians to hear one another better and at the same time allowed
> > >      the audience a good view of each man." (p. 76)
> > >
> > > I never had the privilege of seeing either Watters' or Murphy's band
> > > live, so i can't comment on this arrangement or if Turk kept using it
> > > in his band.
> > >
> > >      Dan
> >
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > -----
> > > >Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 15:25:44 -0500
> > > >From: Stephen Barbone <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>
> > > >Subject: [Dixielandjazz] Re: Trombone Players
> > > >
> > > >  > Mike D wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>  On the subject of acerbic responses to nuisances in the audience,
> > there is a
> > > >>  (possibly apocryphal) story about the blessed Turk Murphy.
Assailed
> > with
> > > >>  repeated requests by a drunk for "Three Little Words", Turk
finally
> > snapped
> > > >>  and said "OK - Go **** Yourself!"  but of course NOBODY would have
> > dared to
> > > >>  try wrapping Turk's trombone around his head......
> > > >
> > > >Yes, I think that may be why the Turkster started to play at
> > > >Earthquake's, in San Francisco, behind the drummer (with the drummer
> > > >between him and the audience) So that he would avoid getting into
> > > >physical trouble with unruly audience members. There were more than
> > > >a few such altercations in his playing days.
> > > >Ah for the days of wild and woolly hot jazz. Mostly gone these days.
> > > >There were lots of other physical manifestations of temperament with
> > > >some of the greats.
> > > >I hear tell that some bands, who have seen pictures of Murphy this
> > > >way, copy the positioning slavishly in the thought that there was
> > > >some musical reason he did this and so they strive to be "correct'.
> > > >;-)
> > > >Cheers,
> > > >Steve Barbone
> > >
> > > --
> > >
**--------------------------------------------------------------------**
> > > **  Dan Augustine    Austin, Texas   ds.augustine at mail.utexas.edu
**
> > > **       "Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through
**
> > > **        the leather straps." -- Emo Phillips
> > > **
> > >
**--------------------------------------------------------------------**
> > >
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> > >
> >
>
>
>
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