[Dixielandjazz] stride vs. comp

[Rob McCallum]

Hello all,

Do you find that part of the drummer's role is also to assist with dynamic
contrast?  It seems that big band drummers act almost as substitute
conductors in "driving" the band, setting up the different sections, and
leading the p's and ff's.  Keeping the beat rests with the hi hat and ride
(and of course the string bass).  Is it the same while playing the dixieland
style?

All the best,
Rob McCallum

----- Original Message -----
From: David W. Littlefield <dwlit at cpcug.org>
To: <dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 11:17 AM
Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] stride vs. comp


> Whatever rhythm instrument one plays, one should do what's appropriate to
> the music genre, the basic style of the band, and what the others are
> playing. This requires knowing what the leader wants and constant
listening
> to the sound of the *whole* band. A relevant factor when playing in public
> is what has entertainment value to the particular audience; relevant also
> when making records.
>
> In OKOM, there's a basic hierarchy: Horns are at the top, piano, then
> banjo/guitar in the middle, bass below them, and drums at the bottom.
> Rhythm players have to understand that they are there to support the
horns,
> to provide a *floor* so the horns play better and the dancers can
> sure-footedly groove the roof. This is true whether the band play a 2-beat
> or 4-beat style.
>
> Piano is the prime fill maker, and constitutionally has the freedom to add
> some touches of syncopation, etc., at other times. But piano must be
> prepared to play straight rhythm, ie boom-chuck, or comp simply,
instantly.
> For example, the second he hears one or more horns playing syncops or
> riffs, he should boom-chuck, because square 4/4 will propel the syncops
> into the stratosphere; the other rhythm cats should do the same. The bass
> player may not like it, but 2-handed piano is part of the old music, and
> boom-chucking gives the rhythm a lot more "whack". Piano should try to
> sense whether the rhytmists want a little space to do fills. The other
> night guitar and I felt the bass want to fill the 7th-8th bars, so we let
> up and gave him the space, last half of tune just stopped at those
> measures; by then he knew we were giving him the floor, so he doubled his
> efforts; we did this for a couple of choruses, and it really lifted the
> whole performance. From an OKOM listener's perspective, the active
2-fisted
> piano adds to the entertainment value.
>
> Banjo/guitar are adjuncts to the percussion. Chunk, chunk, chunk! Listen
> for when piano gives some space. The extent of their freedom depends on
> whether the bass and drums are perfoming their proper roles! They try to
> learn what support each horn soloist prefers. They should consider that a
> constant hard 4 rhythm needs to be relieved regularly or it comes to have
a
> pounding effect. So: some off-beats, held notes, some syncops, glisses, as
> a change-up. Chunk-a chunk-a chunk-a style generally sucks, except that in
> an out chorus it's one very useful changeup for enhancing the intensity of
> the climax. I played/subbed on banjo with a couple of no-piano bands where
> the leader wanted straight 4/4; that was ok, except that whenever I
> listened to both bands off the bandstand, I found the unrelieved 4/4 to be
> colorless, boring, and give that pounding effect. So when I played with
> them, I put in a bit of relief. The drummer of one band used off-beats now
> and again, and standard fills; I usually played right along with him, and
> it was very effective, loads of fun to interact with him, and the
> hornpersons usually were delighted. But basically straight rhythm is
> required, and the main satisfaction for a string player must be to make
the
> band sound and feel better. Of course, the mindful leader will give
> stringplayer some solo space. String (especially banjo) fills and solos
> have decided entertainment value for the general public.
>
> Sorry bass and drums, but your role is basically straight rhythm. KISS. A
> few small changeups are cool, as is an *occasional* break, sometimes even
a
> solo--perhaps a couple per set. Your main creativity must be in supporting
> the rest of the band; of course, the drummer has more tools to work with,
> and that can have significant impact on the sound and feel of the band.
> Bass creativity has little basic entertainment value, can screw up the
band
> very easily.
>
> --Sheik
>
>
> At 08:57 AM 1/22/2003 -0600, Pat Cooke wrote:
> >      IMHO, stride is for solo piano....when you have a bass player,
leave
> >the bass notes for the bass to play.  I find a comping style much easier
to
> >play bass with.
> >      Also, a piano and a banjo(or guitar) in the same band is not a good
> >idea, unless they have played together long enough to know what chords
the
> >other will be using and when to make the changes.
> >      I've played with a number of groups where the piano and banjo are
> >playing different chords at the same time.....Maddening!
> >    Pat Cooke
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Charlie Hull" <Charlie at easysounds.com>
> >To: "Charlie Hooks" <charliehooks at earthlink.net>; "DJML"
> ><dixielandjazz at ml.islandnet.com>
> >Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2003 8:51 AM
> >Subject: Re: [Dixielandjazz] Solos vs. Banjo Styles
> >
> >
> >> IMHO banjo can be compared to piano in a band.  Some pianists can't let
go
> >> of striding or playing every beat even tho they can be set free by
letting
> >> the bass and drums carry the rhythm.  Ditto with banjoists -- many
insist
> >on
> >> playing a chord for every beat, while others -- epitomized by Bill
> >Dendle --
> >> 'comp' like a good pianist, doing off-beat sparks and tasty fillins.
> >> Depends on the band's makeup, too.  If you have both piano and banjo,
you
> >> don't want them both comping and filling at the same time.
> >>
> >> I agree whole-heartedly with Charlie Hooks.  A plink-plink-plink,
> >> chord-on-every-beat banjo or piano can really box in a soloist's
ability
> >to
> >> flow and use passing chords.  To me, it inhibits the imagination and
> >> creative juices.
> >>
> >> But we are each unique, thank the Diety.  Viva la difference!
> >>
> >> Charlie Hull
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >
> >
> >
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